- This topic has 1 reply, 14 voices, and was last updated 16 years, 11 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
Hail Bush our new leader ready to lead us down the path of debt, war, and telling other people how to live their lives!
But really the World Bank has already burdened this region with enough problems. In 1989-1990 after 40 years of foreign aid, Latin America ended up with $430 billion of foreign debt. These “bribes” were paid to leaders who stuck to the central planning development program; the result? The mess we see today.
But now the Americans come to the rescue with another plan, the TLC; more “free trade” of the like proposed by Paul Wolfowitz at the World Bank. More corruption and misguided policy.
But look at the upside, Ticos can wear the latest U.S. fashions, eat the same food, and read the same newspapers translated and printed here for the masses. They can read Thomas Friedman’s column in the New York Times every day and learn what it is that should be done next by the Bush administration to improve the world.
Can we look forward to some U.S. troops to go with our portion of genetically modifed beef?
I suddenly feel sick after reading your post. The reason I moved to Costa Rica was that it WASN’T the US; now I guess CR will just be a mirror image of all that I wanted to leave behind. How very very sad for CR and it’s people. The ghastly junk food places that have made the US population obese will be springing up all over Costa Rica no doubt. The health of the Tico population will suffer greatly if they imitate the US and it’s eating habits. This will be the destruction of a culture sure as I’m sitting here wondering where there is to live that the US hasn’t already gotten its greedy claws into every aspect of life.
I agree simondg… How about “letting people get on with their lives without interference?”
But that would not be the American way or, in years gone by, the British way would it?
The last 1,000 years clearly shows that the USA and before that the British ‘Empire’ absolutely did NOT allow “people get on with their lives without interference” and have interfered and intervened normally using excuses/reasons later proven to be false or more frequently lies to further their agenda and “protect our interests” causing the deaths of TENS OF MILLIONS of innocent people.
Makes you feel real proud huh?
And during our own lifetimes, has our own experience taught us that politicians always tell the truth and have our interests at heart or, has our experience shown us conclusively that it’s only when their lips move that they are lying?
And to this day, I have NOT met one person who can tell me that he has read and understood the 3,000 page CAFTA agreement so how could anyone make a sensible decision?
I saw it on here somewhere, maybe Scott said but if you don’t understand a legal agreement 100% – you don’t sign it.
I guarantee that CAFTA will have some very nasty surprises up it’s sleeve and Costa Rica will not be able to do anything to protect itself.
Much of the culture of CR and of other countries has already been hijacked by Coca Cola, rock and roll, hip hop and blue jeans. The changes bleed into Central America from south america and the caribbean as well as by direct injection from TV, radio and immigration. It is already a world economy and has been for some time. Back water regions eventually get caught up in the stream. Last year, I strolled into a music store in San Ramon to look for some discs by Guadalupe Urbina (I really love her stuff). The store owner/clerk remarked that he sees very few Costa Ricans with an interest in their own culture and folk music any more. I bought the only discs he had by her.
The world is much more than the sum of its components. It changes faster than we do as individuals. It is a stunning development and will only increase in its pace as time goes on. I wouldn’t blame the U.S. It is human nature in general that changes the world.
Besides, what are you going to do, throw rocks at a U.S. battleship? You just can;t stick your head in the sand like the Japanese tried to do 150 years ago. One day, it may well be China that seems to be imposing its culture on poor little Costa Rica. The good news is, that you can still eat rice, beans and pico de gallo with chop sticks.I could have sworn that this was put to a referendum and that the people of Costa Rica voted for it. I don’t think Bush is too popular in CR so they must have had other reasons for passing it. As for reading the document as mentioned in a response to your post, I think you would find that most people worldwide vote for things without reading every single page. They look to their leaders and the media to digest it for them and give them the pros, cons, and the spin. From what I saw, both sides pitched their points very vocally and a majority of the oft described educated and independent Ticos voted SI! If they choose to let this new set of trade rules ruin their country, that is their choice. I think they are much smarter than that. Hopefully the people that were against it will shepherd and require accountability in the process and not let the potential negatives of the agreement prevail. At the end of the day, it is all their choice, not that of Bush or the USA…
As far as we know, Ticos/as voted yes (until any concrete proof arises) and this will be an incredibly difficult transition, not at first, as I imagine they will want to remove the bitter “taste” from Ticos’ mouths before really getting down to business, but I wouldn’t give up on Costa Rica just yet. If and when this turns ugly, Costa Ricans will not just be victims. They are a non-violent people, but are some of the most effect “backtrackers” I know. They’ve thrown out other agreements with Bush (oh, I meant Harken 🙂 before and have had to suffer the legal ramifications without backing down. I understand this is much larger, but my bet is still on them. Don’t forget, according to the voting estimates, half of the country didn’t want this to begin with–they will be watching like hawks. Heck, we fared worse here, where more than half of the voting population didn’t want Bush and yet we got stuck with him! Not to mention how Ticos/as practiced their voting rights yesterday–I don’t care what some have said on the post questioning CR’s democracy, there’s a lot to be learned from people, who right or wrong, got up and made their opinion count— and festively to boot! Take heart…
Oldfrog – The U.S. people voted (in popular opinion) for the war based upon Gov’t information. They listened carefully to the argument and the evidence and then stopped thinking altogether and collectively thought…let’s kill them all; the mob had spoken.
The next twelve months will probably go well in CR; lots of new U.S. firms setting up shop but then little by little the details will seep out and just like in the U.S., the public that was so keen for war at the outset in Iraq and now feel tricked, this nation will want also out of their deal.
If you truly believe that this was a fair referendum you are sadly mistaken. I have heard reports that in the end many people simply spoiled their ballot because they just didn’t know anymore. The margin of victory amounts to around one percent of the population; not much of a mandate is it?
The best move would have been for no one to vote then Arias would claim victory and be solely responsible for the mess that’s about to come.
Remember how the press tried to convince everyone that the war was not about oil…”we don’t need oil, there’s plenty”! Remember that? Every paper and magazine telling the same lies; $100 oil, get used to it.
Oh yeah, while I’m at it. Ethanol is a scam, it costs more energy to produce than oil; it’s all political.
So if people keep reading the IHT, NYT, WSJ, etc..etc.. they’ll soon have a head of mush and a mind full of absurdities and downright contradictions.
Edited on Oct 08, 2007 18:14
It’s sad what happened in the US Simondg…Thankfully, Costa Ricans tend to call their leaders on the carpet when necessary. I have more faith in Ticos to find/prove election fraud (if in fact it did occur) than for it to ever come to light in the US…Today is a personal & politically sad day for me, but Life continues and we must honor & cherish it Tico style, Pura Vida and I hope we keep watching the process as intently as possible….
Posted in the wrong place and reposted here by Scott….
————————————-
Posted Oct 08,2007 11:30 AM Doug Ward
Well. Rat-ified it is.
Time to go visit Hugo and start looking at real estate.
I want NO PART of The Empyre.Thank you for your courteous salutation which I think shows your attitude and disdain for those that disagree with some of your points. Please show me where I said it was a fair referendum.
The gist of my response was that it is their choice and they can choose whether this is a good thing or a bad thing for THEIR country. I have confidence that they can build on the positive aspects of the agreement and weed out the potential negative consequences.
Also, I don’t read any of the publications that you ascribe to me. In fact, you seem to make a lot of assertions as to the habits, thoughts, ideas, of people that debate your diatribe.
Have a beer, get some sunshine, relax… Pura Vida!
oldfrog – a little jest…have a beer, get some sun…etc..
I wasn’t implying that you read those papers, it was a general comment about how people get their news and form their opinions; nothing aimed at you personally. I probably should have made it more clear.
I do think you gave the impression that you trusted in the system with your comments and my point is that it was never fair since one side had a bigger budget and used Govt facilities to back their case etc..
You also said that it was their (Ticos) decision and not GWB; here again I think you perhaps gave an unintended impression and it struck me that you were underestimating the power and financial influence of the YES campaign and their backers in the Whitehouse.
oldfrog’s not bad is it? I just didnt like your all CAPS name and the way it looked. I personally like this one better- shall we hold a vote?
yours smudge
Good evening to all my friends on WLCR. I have been looking at the posts, newspapers and Internet news sources today. I can’t believe all the negativity I’m seeing. Every news outlet keeps droning on and on about the Ticos that voted NO, and how there are so many of them…What about the majority of the 60% voter turnout that voted YES? They seem to have been relegated to second class status. This is supposed to be democracy at work. And yesterday, it did.
If all I hear and read is how the US and others put forth this massive campaign to sway voters, then that means democracy is for sale, doesn’t it? Where were the 40% that stood home? Why did they not just vote no and be done with it? I’ll tell you why, in my opinion, this was so. Costa Rica wanted change. They wanted it for themselves, their children, and their grandchildren. They wanted a brighter future, a more prosperous country, a better lifestyle. The status quo was not good enough, they wanted to control their own destiny, and make a bold change.
They elected a president who was for the agreement, why should they then not be with him on it? It only makes sense that the Ticos are intelligent in making decisions of this magnitude. They know what they are doing.
Many of us are sad that life in Costa Rica will become like life in the US. A place many of us wish to get away from. What about the Costa Ricans? Maybe they want to have the possibility of more income, more appliances, bigger homes, possibly one on the beach. Who the hell are we to deny them the right to have aspirations in their own country, or tell them they cannot decide for themselves what they want? Nobody who is not a native born Tico has that privilege.
It is now time for Costa Rica to work out its opportunities and its challenges. They will have to close the rift created by this divisive issue and move forward. In their gracious style, I’m sure they will.
A little side note; Today was Columbus Day here in the US. We celebrate the discovery of America (even though the indigenous know they were here all along) by a man who has sometimes been clouded in mystery. Columbus brought the news to a world that did not know this land mass existed. His name is not credited to the American continents. That goes to another explorer, Amerigo Vespucci. Many nations have claimed to have him as their native born son, and being of Italian and also possibly Catalan heritage, I feel a sense of pride (not shared by all) of at least the spirit of the day. What I am reminded of today, is the feeling that this entire land mass that was claimed for Spain, unites every one born here, whether north, central or south American, divided by country or state, into one people. We are all Americans!
I hope that spirit will prevail in our feelings, and dealings with one another, as we move into our now, for better or worse, more united future.Pura Vida to all.
“Maybe they want to have the possibility of more income, more appliances, bigger homes, possibly one on the beach. Who the hell are we to deny them the right to have aspirations in their own country, or tell them they cannot decide for themselves what they want? Nobody who is not a native born Tico has that privilege.”
Give them 5, 10, or 20 years and CR will be a true debtor nation, just like the US, with so many people living beyond their means, living off credit cards with usurious interest rates, living in houses that are way too big, driving cars they will never own outright, and then wondering where it all went wrong. There’ll be predatory lenders selling people loans they can not afford, maybe for that beach house. Whoohoo.
My concern is all the people who think CAFTA is a good idea. Did they REALLY make an informed decision? Or did they just listen to the propaganda that promised them this or that? Look what happened in the US. How informed were those people who voted for you-know-who? Didn’t THEY believe the lies they were told (too many to enumerate here!). These are the scary people IMHO (the ones who think they know and yet really know nothing at all!). I will say a prayer for Costa Rica and its citizens. They’re going to need it.I agree that Costa Ricans have a right and a duty to choose their path–Alfred, that includes them questioning the votes if they feel something went wrong. If everything was done appropriately, that will be confirmed and the people of Costa Rica will feel better. That’s what transparency in democracy is all about, not blind acceptance. There was a lot of “fear” induced propaganda on both sides, with one big difference, the NOs were speaking of what might happen and what has happened in other countries while on the other side there were companies telling their workers that if CAFTA did not pass, they would pack and move this very year–Companies that were the MAIN source of income for already low income communities–this was one of a few things I heard. That was not conjecture, those were threats to peoples immediate livelihoods. Even people that do not make a living in these communities felt burdened at the thought that their vote could cause a humble factory worker to loose his/her job. Everyone wants to live well and hopes to provide a better life for their children, but there was a lot more than just the desire to adopt a US style materialism in yesterday’s vote. Now the decision has been made and all who love Costa Rica need to watch and support the people in THEIR process so that Ticos/Ticas can make the best of it somehow…Pura Vida..Rebe
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
