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News media have fixated on the presence of horse meat as adulterating other more expensive cuts of meat, primarily beef. I’m wondering whether any of this protein dilution goes on in CR. I suspect it does.
Last year I had a 70 Euro dinner in Berlin at the Reichstag (Germany’s legislative building) “cafeteria”. The main course was horse – it was very good, and elegantly served.. Of course, calling the Reichstag restaurant a cafeteria redefines the word.
The media frenzy around horse meat seems to focus on three main objections [depending on whether the reportage is Fox, CNN, or Animal Planet]:
-social/cultural stigmas (the ‘nice horsey’/National Velvet/My Little Pony syndrome);
-economic fraud (paying for beef, not horse meat; particularly in sausage);
-medical/health concerns (a commonly used horse pain killer is carcinogenic in humans).
To me, the primary objection is the medical/health one, esp. since CR is well known for overuse of agricultural pesticides which inevitably are translocated up the food web. Several regulars on this forum are almost rabid on this topic. Except for reducing red meat consumption and nasty chemicals, I have no problem with horse-as-food.
I am curious to know if horse is commonly eaten in CR, and also if there are any data on the carcinogen/pesticide/hormone level in Tico meat products. Maybe it’s a red herring [fish is good for you!], since Ticos have a comparatively long life span, and breeding does not seem a problem. Or maybe they only sell red meat to gringos?
PEH
(BTW, anyone growing up in post-WWII Europe is certain to be well acquainted with the taste of horse meat)
[quote=”pharg”] News media have fixated on the presence of horse meat as adulterating other more expensive cuts of meat, primarily beef. I’m wondering whether any of this protein dilution goes on in CR. I suspect it does.
Last year I had a 70 Euro dinner in Berlin at the Reichstag (Germany’s legislative building) “cafeteria”. The main course was horse – it was very good, and elegantly served.. Of course, calling the Reichstag restaurant a cafeteria redefines the word. [/quote]The difference is obviously cultural. Americans have been separated from the European culture for too long.
[quote=”pharg”]The media frenzy around horse meat seems to focus on three main objections [depending on whether the reportage is Fox, CNN, or Animal Planet]:
-social/cultural stigmas (the ‘nice horsey’/National Velvet/My Little Pony syndrome); [/quote]Horses and cattle have both been used by the human population as work animals for millennia. I fail to understand why horses have become treated with deference but not cattle.
[quote=”pharg”] -economic fraud (paying for beef, not horse meat; particularly in sausage); [/quote]
This is an issue of fraudulence. If horse meat were sold as such and priced accordingly we might find that horse meat would become more costly. I don’t know what the price of horse meat is in Europe but paying 70 Euros for a meal is not inexpensive.
[quote=”pharg”] -medical/health concerns (a commonly used horse pain killer is carcinogenic in humans). [/quote]
Wild horses are culled in the U.S. on an annual basis. These animals have never seen medication of any kind and I have not heard that they suffer from any disease that would disqualify them as fit for the table.
[quote=”pharg”] To me, the primary objection is the medical/health one, esp. since CR is well known for overuse of agricultural pesticides which inevitably are translocated up the food web. Several regulars on this forum are almost rabid on this topic. Except for reducing red meat consumption and nasty chemicals, I have no problem with horse-as-food.
I am curious to know if horse is commonly eaten in CR, and also if there are any data on the carcinogen/pesticide/hormone level in Tico meat products. Maybe it’s a red herring [fish is good for you!], since Ticos have a comparatively long life span, and breeding does not seem a problem. Or maybe they only sell red meat to gringos? [/quote]
The typical Tico cannot afford red meat in quantity so I doubt that it is much of an issue for them.
[quote=”pharg”]PEH
(BTW, anyone growing up in post-WWII Europe is certain to be well acquainted with the taste of horse meat)
[/quote]there were butcher shops in the Fifth, near my apartment in Paris, that sold ONLY horse meat. Americans will stuff their faces with all manner of adulterated food-like products, but oh, no, there’s horsemeat!! Arrrrrggggh but turth in labeling has a long way to go before it hits the truth part.
I think it has something to do with developing a “personal relationship” with a horse. Raising, training, riding. We just don’t have that kind of relationship with cows.
and what about the cultures that eat cats and dogs???
i grew up with a cow and a pig as pets. i have a hard time eating them, so i don’t. i didn’t have a horse, but i wouldn’t want to eat that either. eating meat is completely unnecessary to one’s diet and i do not want to be part of any living thing’s suffering. cows, horse, pigs, dogs, cats are all sentient beings.
Define “sentient” please. And compared to what?
And cannibals get nasty diseases specific to their human meat diet.
The point of all this exchange is that people have a right to know and choose what they eat. The topic of eating horse meat was stimulated by the mis-labeling of a horse meat product as beef, in Europe. “Mis-labeling” is the issue, not whether eating horse meat is okay, or not. If you choose to knowingly eat horse meat, that’s okay.
define sentient??? do you think they don’t feel pain, or fear, or suffering, or anxiety as they are being tortured and slaughtered. they don’t have to be compared to anything. they feel all those emotions; they are not just inanimate objects created for our consumption.
[quote=”maravilla”]define sentient??? do you think they don’t feel pain, or fear, or suffering, or anxiety . . .[/quote]
Of course you are right, maravilla. Animals with complex brains (and that goes pretty far down the evolutionary ladder) have all those feelings.
If you’ve ever played with a dog, cat, horse or pet bird, you know that they can feel joy. And if you’ve ever disciplined an animal and see it cringe, you know they feel fear. It is a well known fact that, awaiting slaughter, some hogs look ahead in the line and, seeing their fellows being killed, faint from fear as might we all.
Because they cannot express feelings verbally doesn’t mean they don’t experience them.
[quote=”maravilla”]define sentient??? do you think they don’t feel pain, or fear, or suffering, or [/quote]
As with many other words, the meaning is in the eye [mind] of the beholder. Dictionary meanings of ‘sentient’ involve one or more of:
-responsive to sensory impressions
-awareness of something
-sensitive in perception or feeling.
It comes from the Latin ‘sentire’, to perceiveBy these definitions, an amoeba is sentient, because it will sense and move away from unpleasant temperature, or frantically move by chemically sensing the presence of a predator.
What maravilla & David are mentioning is beyond sentient, and more like thinking and/or ability to predict imminent actions, beyond or after perception. A cat can anticipate playfulness and a pig [being much more intelligent than cats] can understand that its future is rather limited.
But, hey, this is straying far beyond horsemeat lasagna.
PEHHorse meat is quite commonly sold and eaten by Ticos however it is not advertised as such. If you have eaten chorizo or salchichon criollo in CR you have very likely eaten a pony. With all the informal and undercover slaughter houses and butcher shops (midnight cuatreros)the major problem is a health problem.
I am curious to know if horse is commonly eaten in CR, and also if there are any data on the carcinogen/pesticide/hormone level in Tico meat products. Maybe it’s a red herring [fish is good for you!], since Ticos have a comparatively long life span, and breeding does not seem a problem. Or maybe they only sell red meat to gringos?
PEH
[/quote]
“Because they cannot express feelings verbally doesn’t mean they don’t experience them.”
thank you, david. yes, this has strayed from the horsemeat topic but i think if people actually SAW how these animals are treated in CAFOs, and then butchered for your table, it would spawn a new crop of vegans. i don’t adhere to that philosophy per se, but after watching many, many undercover videos about factory farms, i can no longer ignore this awful practice and refuse to be party to the infliction of suffering and torture on an animal whose only crime is that people like to eat it. it’s hard to have an emotional connection to this issue if you have only ever bought supermarket meat, all packaged up and looking good (not to me anymore!).
[quote=”orcas0606″] Horse meat is quite commonly sold and eaten by Ticos however it is not advertised as such. If you have eaten chorizo or salchichon criollo in CR you have very likely eaten a pony. With all the informal and undercover slaughter houses and butcher shops (midnight cuatreros)the major problem is a health problem. [/quote]
I have eaten plenty of both chorizo and salchichon and salchichas as well. I don’t have an issue with horse meat being a part of those products.
[quote=”orcas0606″]I am curious to know if horse is commonly eaten in CR, and also if there are any data on the carcinogen/pesticide/hormone level in Tico meat products. Maybe it’s a red herring [fish is good for you!], since Ticos have a comparatively long life span, and breeding does not seem a problem. Or maybe they only sell red meat to gringos?
PEH
[/quote]There is likely no data on carcinogen/pesticide/hormone levels in the meat here.
To answer Maravilla…having been raised on a farm I know from first hand experience that animals, whether domestic or in the wild, do react to pain and fear. I have heard the vocalizations of animals in fear in both situations.
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