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As I’m sure most people have already heard or already experienced, driving -particularly in the southern part of Mexico can be very dangerous. Far more so than anywhere in C.R. I would guess. I’m not talking about the tourist area’s of Mexico because they’re fairly safe compared to those beautiful toll highways that most Mexican’s can’t afford to take. The police and the criminals compete for business on some of those roads at night. Guns, rapes and other types of violence are common. That is what might happen in C.R. if corruption is allowed to flourish. It’s never happened to me but if it does I’ll take info (car number/plate number etc) and make a report. Corruption leads to chaos.
Latin culture is a lovely blend of festive chaos. It has its dark side but I don’t see that outweighing the light side. A corrupt traffic cop holding out his hand for $20 doesn’t amount to the melt down of social order. People who lament these slight blemishes as major scars are saying more about their own intolerance to one aspect of Costa Rica than they are about petty corruption. There are so many more serious issues to be worried about. This is just something to muse about, not turn into a name calling cat fight.
Edited on Feb 04, 2008 18:51
sprire,
I couldn’t agree with you more….
ssure,
After years of traveling in Mexico, and looking for the “right” place…we realized we couldn’t possibly live in that country…for the reasons you cited…it’s pretty scary to be stopped at a traffic stop by a teenage kid, with a Polica uniform, and an automatic weapon, asking you to get out out the car….but that is only 1 reason we didn’t buy in Mexico…and just because a traffic cop in CR, stops people once in a while does not mean the country is going to Hell in a handbasket…now or anytime soon…these people just don’t have the DNA, genes, or whatever to pull that off…They are , on a whole, friendly, helpful, non-violent, and family oriented..I totally agree with you ssure, I would hate for CR to turn into some sort of free for all where corruption is rampant and the CR we love so much is turned into some unrecognizable place where no one feels protected from extortionists and people looking to ‘help’ you part with any of your belongings.
No catfight or any other kind of fight required. This is about dialogue and differing opinions, not fighting. You think I’m not listening to you, but it’s just the opposite, I have carefully heard every word you’ve said. Through it all you continue to be blind to the points made throughout this whole discussion by myself and others. YOU got your knickers in a knot when the word “gringo” was used because it has a negative connotation about a group of people that looks to negatively generalize the behavior of some as the behavior of a whole group. In effect, being prejudicial in nature. Just as prejudicial as your statements that Latinos have a different priorities when it comes to families and that somehow this means that this is why we ask for bribes and according to you, don’t think this is a problem. However, you considered my feeling offended as coming from someone with a chip on their shoulder. In other words, you feel the right to be upset at someone’s prejudicial words, but don’t think that your own prejudicial statements (probably because you can’t even recognize them) should warrant someone becoming upset. I still think that you should take me up on letting the immigration officers or any other CR official in on how you feel they feel about corruption just because they are Latinos and when they become offended, you may reconsider or spend some very uncomfortable time doing some back peddling — Frankly, one thing is to say these things on a blog and quite another to face a Tico policeman, judge, immigration officer and tell them how you feel about their sense of (in)justice and why– that’s a whole other ball game…If you’re that confident about your assessment of Tico/Latino culture, give it a whirl…I can stand behind my words with any Tico and you should be able to do the same…
You seem to be one of the few that thinks that every traffic cop in CR engages in this type of behavior and that this is behavior that ALL Ticos find acceptable. In fact, those crooked cops pick on tourists because YOU happen to be easier prey than nationals and if you think it’s only about the $, think again. Ticos don’t tolerate this behavior easily and so they are typically avoided. The fact that nationals are NOT as tolerant about this type of behavior should be enough to cue you in that it is NOT considered an acceptable behavior by this culture. If you choose to continue to be blind to it than that’s your business, but don’t insult Ticos and Latinos and expect me to keep my mouth shut about it. I will call you on it every time. You may think you’re not behaving in a culturally prejudicial way, but your behavior is the poster child for implicit prejudice in people that say they’re not prejudice against any particular group, but certainly act it….You might find it interesting to check this website out: https://implicit.harvard.edu/implicit/demo/
to savedbyzero: I agree with you that this is not RAMPANT in CR, a point I have been trying to make throughout this whole thread…However, if you think that the friendly nature of the CR culture precludes them from violence, then may I suggest you visit one of their jails. Violence is a human condition and even the calmest, nicest person can become violent under the right circumstances in spite of whatever DNA issues you’re referring to. In agreeing with Sprite, you’re agreeing that police extortion is okay, that it’s part of the very fabric of CR/Latino culture and that this is okay which can only mean that if it already isn’t rampant, then it will naturally become so…I absolutely don’t agree with that assessment, but that doesn’t mean that I deny that there are some corrupt cops & people in CR (nationals and otherwise)…This forum is an incredible mix of people…
I’m going to go out on a limb & say that neither sprite nor savedbyzero live in Costa Rica currently & possibly have never lived in Costa Rica. They sound like the “looking through rose-colored glasses” tourists who have fallen in love with Costa Rica & just don’t have much real experience here, waxing nostalgic over what are very real, very serious issues to Ticos. Read the newspapers & watch the national news & you will soon see that violence & corruption are a part of the fabric of society here. But you will also learn that most Ticos have no tolerance for it & are looking for ways to curb/eliminate both. Changes are being made – hiring more police (500 or 1000 was the number I read, I think?), more judges holding court sessions 7 days a week to process/penalize criminals faster, putting officials in jail who are caught accepting bribes or committing crimes, detaining corrupt police, not to mention the former presidents who are in trouble because of bribes they took over cell phone contracts…none of this sounds like a culture that is accepting/tolerating corruption!
My husband and I were stopped for speeding we both don’t think that we were speeding. Argue? Don’t think so, it was our first time here. Long story short we ended up paying the bribe. Any country allowing the practice is corrupt. Perhaps changes should start with the rental agencies… A bit of friendly warning like what I’ve seen above would go a long way!
jreeves, you certainly may have hit the nail on, at least, part of the head, but the other part, their perception of values, that they will carry with them no matter from where they write or where they live– we all do…
wilsonke, If you keep on reading, this site it will provide you with a lot of very helpful information. Now you know that you can just politely say to one of those policemen that you will pay the ticket and they will most likely tell you to be on your way or worst case scenario, they will give you the ticket and along with paying it, you can denounce the crooked cop. Please don’t jump to conclusions, we have plenty of corrupt politicians and corporate tycoons in the US and elsewhere – just think of the many US officials indicted recently (along with those not yet indicted) and the Enron executives? The corruption of a few does not mean that ALL people in the US are corrupt. Corruption is a human condition that needs to be addressed whenever it springs up it’s ugly little head and CR has had the moral fortitude to indict it’s corrupt people, including their past presidents. I would say that more than many other countries can attest to having the courage to do so. I actually personally know of a Puerto Viejo municipal official that was caught stealing out of the public coiffures and given the choice by the CR court system to either pay back what he had stolen or face jail time and pay he did. That would have been a just sentence for all of those Enron executives that destroyed the retirement nest eggs of so many hard working individuals and yet they and their families continue to live lavish lifestyles. Consequently, CR is NOT a corrupt country, but just like everywhere else, it does suffer from corruption and we find it, we should try not to promote it. I can assure you that policemen that are caught doing this are punished. This is NOT considered acceptable by CR law nor by CR culture and if this unfortunately happens again, please make sure you take the time to tell the police dept via the email link I provided in one of my posts above. Thanks…
Found a direct link to post a formal complaint about any transit officer that requests a bribe:
http://www.transito.go.cr/denunciasysugerencias/index.html
The previous link I had given was for all police and I have already placed my own complaint about this matter in the hopes something will be done about this.
I was pleasantly surprised to see that there seems to be a new project that is being funded by BID which will deal with just this subject: http://www.poder-judicial.go.cr/bid/ in their court system
and also that they already have a program to create a more transparency within their system of justice which you can review right on the site http://www.poder-judicial.go.cr/
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