- This topic has 1 reply, 10 voices, and was last updated 11 years, 5 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
Scott
please don’t encourage sweikert to leave Chicago
let the delusions continue.
[quote=”Scott”]A couple of important recent quotes for you:
1. [url=http://gainspainscapital.com/2013/07/08/the-one-chart-that-proves-were-not-in-a-recovery/]The One Chart That Proves We’re Not in a “Recovery”[/url]
“As for full-time jobs, well, we LOST 240,000 last month. And despite all the rhetoric coming out of Washington about a “recovery,” we’ve actually only added 130,000 in 2013 so far. To put this into perspective, we need to create at least 90,000 new full-time jobs PER MONTH to maintain employment levels based on population growth.”
2. From David Stockman’s book – [url=http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-06-18/david-stockmans-non-recovery-part-2-crash-breadwinners-and-born-again-jobs-scam ]The Great Deformation[/url].
“By September 2012, the S&P 500 was up by 115 percent from its recession lows and had recovered all of its losses from the peak of the second Greenspan bubble. By contrast, only 200,000 of the 5.6 million lost breadwinner jobs had been recovered by that same point in time.”
3. The number of Americans receiving subsidized food assistance from the federal government [url=http://cnsnews.com/news/article/101m-get-food-aid-federal-gov-t-outnumber-full-time-private-sector-workers]has risen to 101 million[/url], representing roughly a third of the U.S. population.
4. You may also wish to see: [url=http://thetruthwins.com/archives/21-facts-about-rising-government-dependence-in-america-that-will-blow-your-mind]21 Facts About Rising Government Dependence In America That Will Blow Your Mind[/url]
Whether you realize it or not, the U.S. as we have known it during our lifetimes is finished!
No doubt the blame will be put on yet another false flag event but we will see a catastrophic collapse and we will see blood in the streets and I guarantee you that the U.S. government and ‘Homeland Security’ knows that and they are planning for that event….
Problem – Reaction – Solution!
They (the banksters – our owners) create the problem, they (the banksters and their political slaves and ‘law’ enforcers) carefully manage the reaction, they will then make it appear that the people thought up the solution (which they wanted to implement all along) and then it is “solved” by Homeland Security and the other ‘security’ forces…
“For your protection of course!”
Get out while you still can, before the rapidly expanding ‘don’t fly’ list turns into the ‘don’t leave’ list!
[/quote]
Sweikert
it’s good to know that your feeling refreshed 8)8)
I don’t think Scott is trying to change anyone’s opinion. he is giving some examples that may support his current beliefs on the state of the United States of America.
Sadly I find myself in agreement with much of what he sais and its not because I like Scott.. because truth be told I really don’t care for him much.. BUT I am also awake to what is actually going on.
aside from quoting various internet sites one cannot dismiss ones own personal observations and conclusions.
it has been interesting reading your replies in contrast to the replies of the people that your communicating with regardless of the topic.
taking a broader point of view it is obvious your personality is such that you just like to engage in mindless debate.
Am I the only one that see’s this???
It never ceases to amaze me how unconsciously ignorant people are back home.
you could be in the middle of Chicago and have murder rate skyrocket and yet quote various internet sources how things are better.
[b]what would one call this?????[/b]
Less immature.. sure OK.. But I would bet that I am living in a freer society than where you are.
[b]Swiekert you have to stay away from those rice crispy s my friend. [/b]
[quote=”sweikert925″]To Scott:
First let me say that it’s refreshing and appreciated that I get a reply to one of my comments that actually has thoughtfulness behind it and that you don’t resort to insults which some of the less mature participants on this message board feel compelled to resort to.
I also want to head off the comments that would otherwise no doubt come that insist that I think everything is rosy and there is no need to worry. I didn’t state it strongly enough in my earlier comment, but I think there is ample reason for worry – things are not going well (though MUCH better than 4 years ago) and even though the trend line is (in my opinion) positive, there are lots of things that can happen in the near future to plunge us back into recession.
But with all due respect Scott, you can’t seriously expect me to change my opinion based on the sources you cite (with the one exception below) – 2 right wing bloggers with political axes to grind and a financial motive to boot. Graham Summers makes his living by trying to scare the bejeezus out of people and his views have always been of the gloom and doom variety. I could have cited as a reference some opinion piece by one of the sunnier economists – say, Paul Krugman – but I didn’t because one man’s opinion is just one man’s opinion. You can find individual economists that are all over the map about where the economy is now and is headed. But at least the sources of your opinions are better than lvc1028’s (source: “Because I said so”).
I do have a high opinion of David Stockman (even though he’s selling a book and therefore has an axe to grind). His opinions are thoughtful and should to be listened to. There is much that he has to say that I totally agree with as in this:
[i]”The destruction of fiscal rectitude under Ronald Reagan — one reason I resigned as his budget chief in 1985 — was the greatest of his many dramatic acts. It created a template for the Republicans’ utter abandonment of the balanced-budget policies of Calvin Coolidge and allowed George W. Bush to dive into the deep end, bankrupting the nation through two misbegotten and unfinanced wars, a giant expansion of Medicare and a tax-cutting spree for the wealthy that turned K Street lobbyists into the de facto office of national tax policy. In effect, the G.O.P. embraced Keynesianism — for the wealthy.”[/i]
But this statement is, in my opinion, and in the opinion of most economists, utter nonsense:
[i]”There was never a remote threat of a Great Depression 2.0 or of a financial nuclear winter, contrary to the dire warnings of Ben S. Bernanke, the Fed chairman since 2006. The Great Fear — manifested by the stock market plunge when the House voted down the TARP bailout before caving and passing it — was purely another Wall Street concoction. Had President Bush and his Goldman Sachs adviser (a k a Treasury Secretary) Henry M. Paulson Jr. stood firm, the crisis would have burned out on its own and meted out to speculators the losses they so richly deserved. The Main Street banking system was never in serious jeopardy, ATMs were not going dark and the money market industry was not imploding.”[/i]
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/31/opinion/sunday/sundown-in-america.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0
It is true that we lost 240,000 full time jobs in June 2013 over May, but that’s just one month’s data. Year over year, we GAINED 1.4 million full time jobs from June 2012 to June 2013. (It is a mark of intellectual dishonesty to cherry pick your data – as Summers does – and use that to make wild claims of impending doom.)
(See this source, http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.htm, scroll down to table A-9)
And on that subject while it is true that the BLS has calculated that 28 million of the 144 million employed are working part time, that doesn’t mean they all want full time jobs. The BLS breaks that down further into those working part time for economic reasons and those who work part time for other reasons – such as students in college who work part time. Of those 28 million, only 8 million work part time due to economic necessity.
(Table A-8 in the link above)
Much is made of the fact that the economy is running on borrowed money. Well borrowed money is a basic fact of capitalism. There is never a time when we are NOT running on borrowed money. There is a wise way to manage borrowing and a foolish way to do so and certainly the way some governments have done it lately is foolish. But I would remind everyone that what got us out the Great Depression of the 1930s was borrowed money, a higher debt to GDP ratio than what is currently the case and we managed to survive – even thrive.
In a couple of years it will become apparent which of us is right about the direction of the US economy and so anyone reading this then will know that. That’s assuming this thread is allowed to remain posted – it’s your message board and you can delete it if you choose. I hope you won’t.
Speaking of which, what happened to the Dengue Fever thread? Why was that deleted?[/quote]
[quote=”sweikert925″]To Scott:
First let me say that it’s refreshing and appreciated that I get a reply to one of my comments that actually has thoughtfulness behind it and that you don’t resort to insults which some of the less mature participants on this message board feel compelled to resort to.
I also want to head off the comments that would otherwise no doubt come that insist that I think everything is rosy and there is no need to worry. I didn’t state it strongly enough in my earlier comment, but I think there is ample reason for worry – things are not going well (though MUCH better than 4 years ago) and even though the trend line is (in my opinion) positive, there are lots of things that can happen in the near future to plunge us back into recession.
But with all due respect Scott, you can’t seriously expect me to change my opinion based on the sources you cite (with the one exception below) – 2 right wing bloggers with political axes to grind and a financial motive to boot. Graham Summers makes his living by trying to scare the bejeezus out of people and his views have always been of the gloom and doom variety. I could have cited as a reference some opinion piece by one of the sunnier economists – say, Paul Krugman – but I didn’t because one man’s opinion is just one man’s opinion. You can find individual economists that are all over the map about where the economy is now and is headed. But at least the sources of your opinions are better than lvc1028’s (source: “Because I said so”).
I do have a high opinion of David Stockman (even though he’s selling a book and therefore has an axe to grind). His opinions are thoughtful and should to be listened to. There is much that he has to say that I totally agree with as in this:
[i]”The destruction of fiscal rectitude under Ronald Reagan — one reason I resigned as his budget chief in 1985 — was the greatest of his many dramatic acts. It created a template for the Republicans’ utter abandonment of the balanced-budget policies of Calvin Coolidge and allowed George W. Bush to dive into the deep end, bankrupting the nation through two misbegotten and unfinanced wars, a giant expansion of Medicare and a tax-cutting spree for the wealthy that turned K Street lobbyists into the de facto office of national tax policy. In effect, the G.O.P. embraced Keynesianism — for the wealthy.”[/i]
But this statement is, in my opinion, and in the opinion of most economists, utter nonsense:
[i]”There was never a remote threat of a Great Depression 2.0 or of a financial nuclear winter, contrary to the dire warnings of Ben S. Bernanke, the Fed chairman since 2006. The Great Fear — manifested by the stock market plunge when the House voted down the TARP bailout before caving and passing it — was purely another Wall Street concoction. Had President Bush and his Goldman Sachs adviser (a k a Treasury Secretary) Henry M. Paulson Jr. stood firm, the crisis would have burned out on its own and meted out to speculators the losses they so richly deserved. The Main Street banking system was never in serious jeopardy, ATMs were not going dark and the money market industry was not imploding.”[/i]
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/31/opinion/sunday/sundown-in-america.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0
It is true that we lost 240,000 full time jobs in June 2013 over May, but that’s just one month’s data. Year over year, we GAINED 1.4 million full time jobs from June 2012 to June 2013. (It is a mark of intellectual dishonesty to cherry pick your data – as Summers does – and use that to make wild claims of impending doom.)
(See this source, http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.htm, scroll down to table A-9)
And on that subject while it is true that the BLS has calculated that 28 million of the 144 million employed are working part time, that doesn’t mean they all want full time jobs. The BLS breaks that down further into those working part time for economic reasons and those who work part time for other reasons – such as students in college who work part time. Of those 28 million, only 8 million work part time due to economic necessity.
(Table A-8 in the link above)
Much is made of the fact that the economy is running on borrowed money. Well borrowed money is a basic fact of capitalism. There is never a time when we are NOT running on borrowed money. There is a wise way to manage borrowing and a foolish way to do so and certainly the way some governments have done it lately is foolish. But I would remind everyone that what got us out the Great Depression of the 1930s was borrowed money, a higher debt to GDP ratio than what is currently the case and we managed to survive – even thrive.
In a couple of years it will become apparent which of us is right about the direction of the US economy and so anyone reading this then will know that. That’s assuming this thread is allowed to remain posted – it’s your message board and you can delete it if you choose. I hope you won’t.
Speaking of which, what happened to the Dengue Fever thread? Why was that deleted?[/quote]
One can find resources to support any argument if they look hard enough. And although you find “right wing” bloggers to be less than credible sources can you really claim that the information being “provided” by the US Government is any less suspect? Do you really think the unemployment numbers truly represent the reality of todays job market? Do they take into account underemployment at all? How about the inflation numbers put out by the US Government? You shop I assume… do you really think inflation is under control and running at about 3% or so? Do you know how they’ve played with how both unemployment and inflation are calculated to serve the government’s agenda?
If everything is so wonderful and under control in the US with nothing but clear skys and a calm sea on the horizon why is it that you, as an intelligent person who has worked hard his entire life, made the right choices, saved, done his homework and considered his future….can’t survive financially in retirement in the place you’ve called home your entire life?
That’s the REAL question you should be asking yourself. After you answer that you’ll start to question all the other issues folks bring up about what’s wrong in the US that you adamantly seek to dispute constantly.
sweikert925
WOW!!!! :shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock::shock:
So based on this post
you actually are that gullible to believe in what the Government of the United States Of America puts out???
How many times do you need to be lied to before one’s words become suspect???
See.. it’s people like you my friend that is actually perpetuating the delusion and it’s destructive path.
How can there be so much contrast in this discussion???
We are watching the same movie.. maybe it’s because your sitting so darn close to the screen that you can only see whats in front of you and no further.
I don’t know…
It’s not that these are the things I want to happen.. I just see things for what they are nothing more nothing less and plan accordingly.
Your a very interesting fellow.. Sweikert and just for the record I hope all your plans come to fruition.
But I must add this reminds me of similar mentality of the German Jews that simply could not believe anything would ever happen to them so they stayed until it was too late.
There is one thing that you said that I would agree
[b]
we will in our lifetimes know who was right or wrong.[/b][quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]
One can find resources to support any argument if they look hard enough.
[/quote]EXACTLY. Which sounds a lot like what I said here:
[i]You can find individual economists that are all over the map about where the economy is now and is headed.[/i]
[quote=”imxploring”]
And although you find “right wing” bloggers to be less than credible sources can you really claim that the information being “provided” by the US Government is any less suspect?
[/quote]Yes, I can. Especially since one of those right wing bloggers used that same source of information (though it was cherry picked) to back up his own conclusions about the health of the job market.
The statistics that the government publishes are the collective effort of hundreds of people and are vetted by all kinds of experts both inside and outside government. If the BLS was publishing lies don’t you think the Wall Street Journal or Fox News or the Republican leaders of Congress would have raised a stink about that? Why are you so quick to assume they’re wrong, other than they inconveniently undercut your position and reinforce mine? Do you have any actual evidence of that?
If you know of another, more credible source of information about the jobs picture feel free to share it. But if you automatically discount any information that the government issues then there’s no point in even discussing this. If the numbers reinforced your position I have no doubt that you would have no trouble believing them.
[quote=”imxploring”]
Do you really think the unemployment numbers truly represent the reality of todays job market?
[/quote]Yes, especially if you look into the detailed breakdown which – as you can see from above – I have.
[quote=”imxploring”]
Do they take into account underemployment at all?
[/quote]Sure they do and they publish that number every month in a metric called U-6.
[quote=”imxploring”]
How about the inflation numbers put out by the US Government? You shop I assume… do you really think inflation is under control and running at about 3% or so?
[/quote]Yes, I do. I see no reason to doubt that. My own spending pattern doesn’t indicate otherwise but I wouldn’t dream of suggesting that my own spending pattern is in any way an indication of anything other than my own spending pattern.
[quote=”imxploring”]
If everything is so wonderful and under control in the US with nothing but clear skys and a calm sea on the horizon…
[/quote]Wow, I went out of my way to say this:
[i]I also want to head off the comments that would otherwise no doubt come that insist that I think everything is rosy and there is no need to worry. I didn’t state it strongly enough in my earlier comment, but I think there is ample reason for worry – things are not going well (though MUCH better than 4 years ago) and even though the trend line is (in my opinion) positive, there are lots of things that can happen in the near future to plunge us back into recession.[/i]
and STILL you insist on putting those words in my mouth.
[quote=”imxploring”]
…why is it that you, as an intelligent person…
[/quote]Why thank you, that’s the nicest thing anyone has ever said to me since I joined this discussion board.
[quote=”imxploring”]
…who has worked hard his entire life, made the right choices, saved, done his homework and considered his future….can’t survive financially in retirement in the place you’ve called home your entire life?
[/quote]Who said I can’t survive financially in retirement here in Chicago? I never said or even hinted at that. I can do quite nicely here, thank you, based on the current state of my finances. I will have Social Security, 2 private pensions plus a decently sized 401K balance. I did NOT make all the right choices – I didn’t open a 401K until I was 31, a decade after I really should have and I haven’t been as frugal as I now wish I had been. But I made ENOUGH right choices to allow for a comfortable retirement here in the US – I just want the extra financial cushion plus the adventure that would come with retiring to Costa Rica. And the weather is SO much nicer there.[/quote]
I guess there’s an interesting question here…. who has more to GAIN by massaging the numbers and the resulting “truth” about current US unemployment, inflation, and current monetary policy…. right wing bloggers or politicians concerned about their next election?
It’s a rhetorical question…. no need for a lengthy retort Steve. LOL
I do agree with David…. perhaps you should move back a bit from the TV…
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]… who has more to GAIN by massaging the numbers and the resulting “truth” about current US unemployment, inflation, and current monetary policy…. right wing bloggers or politicians concerned about their next election?[/quote]
Right wing bloggers of course. Graham Summers peddles gloom and doom for a living, he directly benefits financially by making things look bleak.
The people who prepare and publish the numbers are not politicians, they are professional economists and statisticians and you seem to assume that they would let their political bosses tamper with their work without a murmur of protest. And you assume that with absolutely no evidence, merely because you are confronted with a fact that contradicts your preconceived conclusions.[/quote]
You seem to believe that career politicians (Congress, The Senate, elected officals at all levels, and all those political appointees) have no influence whatsoever over the “professionals” that you hold in such high regard. THAT statement in itself tells me you have NO idea how government and politics actually function. With 28 years of government involvement I Can speak personally that nothing could be further from the truth. That’s NOT a preconceived notion, that’s personal knowledge and experience! What might I ask is the personal knowledge you have in drawing your conclusion? Or is it just and idealistic vision of how society should function in the utopia that you envision the US as?
When the State Department spokesman was repeatedly telling the public that the Secretary of State (Kerry) WASN’T out on his boat sailing around while Egypt was coming apart was that a true statement? Were they just mistaken because the professional in charge of keeping tabs on his whereabouts lost track of him? NOPE…. that was an out and out LIE designed to serve a POLITICAL purpose. If that small issue was something they were willing to lie about what makes you think that many OTHER issues and FACTS are not being manipulated to serve political purposes of those desperately trying to keep their jobs?
Was it a Secret Service agent that broke the story that Clinton was getting personal service from an intern in the oval office yet was providing sworn testimony (lies) that he had not? Seems those “professionals” were willing to keep their mouths shut unlike the intern.
It happens EVERY day in politics. Worker bees in government keep their mouths shut and follow orders.There are no truly independent offices in government that buck the system with any true force. Even the GOA is not truly independent or objective. If they were the public would be aware of the true national debt and how deep in trouble the US is!
Well said, imx :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:
[quote=”imxploring”][quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]… who has more to GAIN by massaging the numbers and the resulting “truth” about current US unemployment, inflation, and current monetary policy…. right wing bloggers or politicians concerned about their next election?[/quote]
Right wing bloggers of course. Graham Summers peddles gloom and doom for a living, he directly benefits financially by making things look bleak.
The people who prepare and publish the numbers are not politicians, they are professional economists and statisticians and you seem to assume that they would let their political bosses tamper with their work without a murmur of protest. And you assume that with absolutely no evidence, merely because you are confronted with a fact that contradicts your preconceived conclusions.[/quote]
You seem to believe that career politicians (Congress, The Senate, elected officals at all levels, and all those political appointees) have no influence whatsoever over the “professionals” that you hold in such high regard. THAT statement in itself tells me you have NO idea how government and politics actually function. With 28 years of government involvement I Can speak personally that nothing could be further from the truth. That’s NOT a preconceived notion, that’s personal knowledge and experience? What might I ask is the personal knowledge you have in drawing your conclusion? Or is it just and idealistic vision of how society should function in the utopia that you envision the US as?
When the State Department spokesman was repeatedly telling the public that the Secretary of State (Kerry) WASN’T out on his boat sailing around while Egypt was coming apart was that a true statement? Were they just mistaken because the professional in charge of keeping tabs on his whereabouts lost track of him? NOPE…. that was an out and out LIE designed to serve a POLITICAL purpose. If that small issue was something they were willing to lie about what makes you think that many OTHER issues and FACTS are not being manipulated to serve political purposes of those desperately trying to keep their jobs?
Was it a Secret Service agent that broke the story that Clinton was getting personal service from an intern in the oval office yet was providing sworn testimony (lies) that he had not? Seems those “professionals” were willing to keep their mouths shut unlike the intern.
It happens EVERY day in politics. Worker bees in government keep their mouths shut and follow orders.There are no truly independent offices in government that buck the system with any true force. Even the GOA is not truly independent or objective. If they were the public would be aware of the true national debt and how deep in trouble the US is![/quote]
hahahahaha
because a government official lied about something!!!:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
cmom man.. get your head out of your ass and deploy some critical thinking!!!!
you speak as if this was an isolated event.. are you that naive????
You have to at least consent that for the amount of power the government yields and the numerous amount of lies ( that we actually know about) don’t you think that they should always be at least suspect???
we live in a society that telling the truth could be a dangerous thing.
you did bring up a good comparison between the 2 extreme predictions.
what you never ever bring up is actually human nature.. the tendency of people when they are in position of authority.
you state exactly what imxploring commented.. this idealistic vision on how the US should be.
but its not..
it would be nice.. I would love to give my trust to all elected officials and believe they have my best interest at heart.. I really would.
life would be so much simpler instead of this bullshit!!!
but to believe that would be like that scene from the matrix Ignorance is Bliss!!!
it simple would not be true.
anyway.. enough of this mental masturbating
enjoy your bubble life in chicago!!!
btw. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/07/fourth-of-july-violence-c_n_3558463.html
congratulations on reaching your milestone for you guys
but then again its all looking good for the windy city.
isnt’chicago a gun free city!??? oh yea.. only the Police and criminals have guns
the law abiding citizens are left to get into a fetal position and whelp for help..
[quote=”sweikert925″]OK, let me see if I have it right. Because a government official lied about something, you feel free to assume any facts issued by any other official or branch of government that is inconvenient to your opinions is a lie. Got it.
I assume at some point in your life you told a lie. (I can assume that with no evidence because you assume things with no evidence so that is apparently OK). Therefore I can claim anything you say now or at any point in the future is a lie. I wouldn’t dream of actually doing that, but according to your rules of logic I could.[/quote]
Lied about something? It’s a chronic condition. I’m wondering how inconvenient the government “facts” told to the men of the Tuskegee Experiment were to them … or how inconvenient it was to the Ground Zero clean up crew by the governement telling them the “fact” the area was safe and hazard free for them to work in!
The government (and not just that of the USA) manipulate facts to present us with the picture they want portrayed to us. They don’t trust we can handle the truth … and my guess is most can’t.
[quote=”sweikert925″]OK, let me see if I have it right. Because a government official lied about something, you feel free to assume any facts issued by any other official or branch of government that is inconvenient to your opinions is a lie. Got it.
I assume at some point in your life you told a lie. (I can assume that with no evidence because you assume things with no evidence so that is apparently OK). Therefore I can claim anything you say now or at any point in the future is a lie. I wouldn’t dream of actually doing that, but according to your rules of logic I could.[/quote]
Thank you. 🙂
[quote=”pixframe”]Lied about something? It’s a chronic condition. I’m wondering how inconvenient the government “facts” told to the men of the Tuskegee Experiment were to them … or how inconvenient it was to the Ground Zero clean up crew by the governement telling them the “fact” the area was safe and hazard free for them to work in!
The government (and not just that of the USA) manipulate facts to present us with the picture they want portrayed to us. They don’t trust we can handle the truth … and my guess is most can’t.
[quote=”sweikert925″]OK, let me see if I have it right. Because a government official lied about something, you feel free to assume any facts issued by any other official or branch of government that is inconvenient to your opinions is a lie. Got it.
I assume at some point in your life you told a lie. (I can assume that with no evidence because you assume things with no evidence so that is apparently OK). Therefore I can claim anything you say now or at any point in the future is a lie. I wouldn’t dream of actually doing that, but according to your rules of logic I could.[/quote][/quote]
pixframe
Thank you 🙂
but I think sweikert will find some internet site that will dispute this as well
lying and corruption is part of government.. and like you say.. ALL governments are corrupt ( and incompetent)
the difference with the U.S. is the SIZE of government!!!
corruption is here as well but its a smaller government
heck.. I actually commend Costa Rica.. as they may be one of the few countries that actually imprisoned 2 past presidents..
do you think a U.S. president will EVER be imprisoned??
[quote=”pixframe”]Lied about something? It’s a chronic condition. I’m wondering how inconvenient the government “facts” told to the men of the Tuskegee Experiment were to them … or how inconvenient it was to the Ground Zero clean up crew by the governement telling them the “fact” the area was safe and hazard free for them to work in!
The government (and not just that of the USA) manipulate facts to present us with the picture they want portrayed to us. They don’t trust we can handle the truth … and my guess is most can’t.
[quote=”sweikert925″]OK, let me see if I have it right. Because a government official lied about something, you feel free to assume any facts issued by any other official or branch of government that is inconvenient to your opinions is a lie. Got it.
I assume at some point in your life you told a lie. (I can assume that with no evidence because you assume things with no evidence so that is apparently OK). Therefore I can claim anything you say now or at any point in the future is a lie. I wouldn’t dream of actually doing that, but according to your rules of logic I could.[/quote][/quote]
silly me – I thought the topic was a discussion about the relationship and consequences of the U.S. economy to that of Costa Rica. Instead, we are treated to anti-U.S. polemics and daily cannonades of Sweikert-versus-WLCR.
I was expecting that beloved moderator would terminate the diatribes and suggest that PMs are more appropriate for those who slaver wide-eyed their convictions [or could it be that he enjoys the bashings from the left and the right?][quote=”pharg”]silly me – I thought the topic was a discussion about the relationship and consequences of the U.S. economy to that of Costa Rica. Instead, we are treated to anti-U.S. polemics and daily cannonades of Sweikert-versus-WLCR.
I was expecting that beloved moderator would terminate the diatribes and suggest that PMs are more appropriate for those who slaver wide-eyed their convictions [or could it be that he enjoys the bashings from the left and the right?][/quote]Not an anti US rant. Just an exchange about the reality we ALL face from our own governments. That includes the folks steering the boat in CR.
The issue is the US economy and it’s impact or connection to CR. What’s at issue in this conversation is that the “facts” we’re being presented with by our governments are not always in step with the reality!
The economy in the US is in serious trouble. The current fiscal policy is going to come back to haunt us, and as such it is a very important issue to CR.
[quote=”imxploring”]I guess there’s an interesting question here…. who has more to GAIN by massaging the numbers and the resulting “truth” about current US unemployment, inflation, and current monetary policy…. right wing bloggers or politicians concerned about their next election?
It’s a rhetorical question…. no need for a lengthy retort Steve. LOL
I do agree with David…. perhaps you should move back a bit from the TV…[/quote]
Good point. I think this is all a moot point. No one is gong to change Sweikert’s mind. That’s fine. But he just sucks us in to the mindless debate and that is our choice. He talks about what he reads…not what he lives. “Because I said so”, is not how I live as he says. I based my opinion on what I see…not what I read. I wonder how he figures into the equation all of the people that are no longer collecting UI benefits. They are unemployed, right? So, those millions no longer collecting a nickel…what would that do to the 7+% rate? Hmmm. Inflation. Maybe, he doesn’t do the shopping. I go to the store and spend $1.50 on an apple or a green pepper–and they’re grown here locally. And, BTW, gas is still $3.70 a gallon here. And, yes, the stock market is doing well compared to the lows it hit.
It’s all a moot point. There are people with open minds and those that dig their heels in. Those convinced against their will are of the same opinion still.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
