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Dear Sprite, How can I blame you for admiring wonderful ideals such as that every Cuban irrespective of gender or skin color would be considered equal, have access to education and health services and have their basic needs met? I don’t, the ideals are marvelous it’s the methodology that’s flawed. I have agreed with you on many of your postings and disagreed on others, but always with great respect of a person I only know in this virtual world of the WLCR Forum.
When I was very young, I would send my letters inside the envelopes where my parents were also sending letters to relatives in Cuba and my letters would sometimes be missing by the time they reached my family’s hands. I couldn’t understand then that an innocent wish expressed to be able to meet my cousins or visit them was a HUGE no no and considered against the revolutionary ideals of that country??? So I grew up being more careful in my expressions and also not getting to bond with my family. I don’t discount the experiences you have had in Cuba and I would hope you would also consider the other experiences, though different from your own, which also tell of the Cuban story.
I am also fully aware, as most thinking individuals would agree, that the Embargo has served to make the situation in Cuba even more unbearable. That said, involuntary manslaughter is still a crime the last time I checked in most countries, the intention may not have been to hurt someone, but the outcome of involuntary manslaughter is still death and destruction all the same. I’m certain of Fidel’s brilliance, but I do not know Castro’s heart, I can only judge based on the results of his actions. Like I said, sometimes people, governments and even whole countries get lost along the way and it’s honest to goodness real people that pay the price which is why I hope and pray for change on that island…and a change that is determined by the Cubans living inside the island because they have earned that right by having to withstand such incredible conditions and oppressions for almost 50 yrs now…
I consider myself Latina with family members from and spread throughout Spain, France, Cuba, Venezuela, US and Costa Rica (which is one of the tender spots in my heart), but in the end I’m really a citizen of this world and in my own small and humble way responsible for and to ALL life within in it, including Gaia itself–so when I proclaim that freedom is what I hope for in whatever country I live in, it’s because that is also my hope for the rest of humanity…Pura Vida Sprite!
Rebaragon,
I have spent too many years in the U.S. listening to outrageous and harmful lies told to us by our media and government about Cuba as well as other topics. i try to guard myself from going too far to the left in defense of the truths I experienced in Cuba.
All I can say in the end is that the majority of Cubans chose their path over the last 50 years and that path has evolved. There are no Stalin gulags except for Guantanamo, no mass executions and no starving masses. We see some of these things elsewhere but not in Cuba.All the other nuances and personal stories are anecdotal at best. I don’t automatically doubt them but the bottom line is that I believe the vast majority of Cubans are content with their socialist revolution.
Un fuerte “PURA VIDA” pa ti, tambien y Viva La revolucion, compai…..
Edited on Nov 16, 2007 09:03
Nothing would make me happier than to see all religions and other barbaric practices scoured from the surface of the planet. Barring that, what would you suggest we do? Invade?
We used to burn witches here 250 years ago before our constitution and after, we used hang blacks up until less than 120 years ago. In light of these examples, I don’t see how anyone can throw free speech up as something of great value during those times. The culture dominates with or without it.
Memo to Ron Paul supporters
supportershttp://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2007/11/memo_to_ron_paul_supporters.html
Edited on Nov 16, 2007 12:59
Sprite: when you say that you would like to scour every religion off the face of the planet this sends chills through me. How would you propose to do this? Take us out and shoot us? Put us in internment camps? Are you aware that religion, (even Christianity) isn’t all dark? That to fulfill your wish you would be denigrating and spitting on one of our most fundamental human rights? Is it possible to disagree without promoting hostility and intolerance? This, incidentally is not just the property of religion. Political and other secular ideolgies can be, and often are, also carried to such extremes. Don’t tar all of us with the same brush.
Whether you or anyone else chooses not to acknowledge the lack of freedoms in Cuba doesn’t make them any less there. Freedom of speech is intrinsic to being human since speech not only defines us ideologically, but actually formulates us neurologically and psychologically. No one should be able to curtail the natural physiological development of another human being. Just as we gasp at the thought of people breaking the bones and binding the feet of Asian girls or performing genital mutilation on a child to comply with a cultural guideline set by MEN, we should also gasp at the thought that any ideology should try to bind and mutilate the minds of others…
I hate the fact that Cubans, my family and 11 million other people, cannot experience freedoms I hold dear. You’re incredibly deluded if you think the Cuban people signed up for this. They signed up for a revolution that was more Cuban than the “Cuban Palm trees” and ended up with a Marxist regime (surprise, surprise, surprise).The FOUR FREEDOMS are considered part of the inspiration for the UN Human Rights Declaration and were mentioned in President Roosevelt’s speech:
“ In the future days, which we seek to make secure, we look forward to a world founded upon four essential human freedoms.
The first is FREEDOM OF SPEECH and expression–everywhere in the world.The second is FREEDOM OF EVERY PERSON TO WORSHIP God in his own way–everywhere in the world. (and that includes the choice NOT to worship)
The third is FREEDOM FROM WANT–which, translated into universal terms, means economic understandings which will secure to every nation a healthy peacetime life for its inhabitants-everywhere in the world.
The fourth is FREEDOM FROM FEAR–which, translated into world terms, means a world-wide reduction of armaments to such a point and in such a thorough fashion that no nation will be in a position to commit an act of physical aggression against any neighbor–anywhere in the world.
That is no vision of a distant millennium. It is a definite basis for a kind of world attainable in our own time and generation. That kind of world is the very antithesis of the so-called new order of tyranny which the dictators seek to create with the crash of a bomb.
”
— Franklin Delano Roosevelt, excerpted from the Annual Message to the Congress, January 6, 1941By the way, the very nature of “human rights” is that they are intrinsic and not EVER to be considered for some and not for others…You might have left Cuba’s extremists on the island, but you clearly carry them in your heart while living a comfortable life in the US which I find incredibly convenient. You’re also obviously happy to sacrifice any human being by writing them off as “anecdotal” in order to fit your political schema–I guess rationalizing abhorrent behavior is okay with you as long as the behavior comes from people that think like you and that my friend is much more profoundly troubling than any WLCR posts could ever address–I hope your never find yourself on the other end of that stick Sprite–Life has a funny way of turning things around when you least expect it and I know plenty of people IN the island that are hoping for a change–I hope that when that time comes it will be a much more peaceful transition than what the last failed promise gave birth to and actually a TRUE Cuban construct not one developed through convenient ideologies of men without compassion…
Roark – Surely this is not serious political debate? I will take the first point raised by this “writer” in your link and treat it with the contempt it deserves.
He says Paul is inconsistent because he would take someone’s liberty over a policy disagreement. This writer shows in this statement that he has no idea of personal accountability which is to a greater extent what libertarians stand for. (i.e. don’t rely on the Govt for your needs).
Those with the ability to think objectively realise that since the reasons given for going to war were nothing but a pack of lies, those responsible should be held accountable for the ensuing mess.
That the Government should concoct a web of lies in order to get good men and women to die for their country is bad enough, but that now, knowing the facts as we do, some still defend this kind of madness is frankly a disturbing reflection on how the masses can be manipulated.
Going against the crowd takes bravery; as we can see from this attempt at character assassination, it is not often a rewarding position to take.
Far from being inconsistent Ron Paul is probably the only one with any consistency on this subject and enough integrity to do the right thing. In the U.K. one other brave politician stepped down from Parliament in protest, he too deserves everyone’s full respect.
The fact is that the Founding Fathers would be ashamed of what the U.S is doing since it goes against all their principles.
I could debate every single point in that article and prove them to be each as worthless as the next….
I am of course referring to scouring from the face of the planet the ignorance that supports and encourages religions and the ensuing damage done by religions. I would not ever want to see violence used against anyone for whatever silly belief system they have.
One good thing about Ron Paul and libertarians is that they would never have government sponsored religion as we do here and elsewhere today.Well, I’m glad you “cleared” that up because you obviously don’t mind the killing and incarceration for other differences of opinion practiced by Cuba to this day. Well, you didn’t say you didn’t support the incarceration of little old ladies that wished to continue to practice their faith, you just said you didn’t think they should be killed for it–to be exact…I guess some compassion is better than none….I think that your support of ruling Cuba with an IRON FIST that you’ve so clearly and unabashedly reiterated on the Forum makes it crystal clear how Che could have felt justified in acting as ruthlessly as he did in Cuba–it’s not a long leap from blind ideology (of any kind political, religious, etc) to ruthless dictatorship…I appreciate the show and tell…
As far as religion goes, I do LOVE the fact that this country chose early on NOT to enforce how someone should believe, but rather the RIGHT for everyone to self-determine that belief. The Founding Fathers were NOT nonbelievers by a long stretch of the imagination Sprite, they only knew that it is DANGEROUS when one human being feels he has the right to tell another what faith to practice or that NO faith should be practiced at all. Belief practices are a part of every single culture on the face of the planet and I can actually show you a part of your temporal lobe that when activated will produce an experience similar to a religious experience like those people write about across all religious practices (Eastern, Western and even in less organized or recognized faith based practices). The worst thing about religious beliefs are not the beliefs themselves, it’s the people (mostly men like you) who think the ideology they are certain is the TRUTH gives them the right to oppress others that do not share their “truth.” Now of course, there are our explicit beliefs which is what we tell others and consciously think we in fact believe and then there are our implicit biases that are what we ACTUALLY do believe and ACT out on. If you ask me, that sounds just like the explicit believes you have been proposing all along on this thread. You might want to review what you have stated, ask yourself what you have been capable of doing to support those believes and then take your own advice and stop promoting violence to support ideology–of any kind!
Just to clarify the temporal lobe reference I made earlier. This does NOT by any means indicate that our spiritual experiences are merely in our brains. Other parts of the human brain can also be activated and you can actually smell, taste and feel how you felt when you ate your grandma’s apple pie and that certainly doesn’t mean your grandma didn’t exist nor that her apple pies weren’t gloriously delicious. What this does indicate is that you made a significant connection with them that can now be accessed. We ARE wired to believe in something other than ourselves, but remember that nature has NO moral basis (just think how differently a predator and a prey view the same act…). This is why a spiritual practice can be wonderful or it can be horrific, it all depends on how WE choose to practice our beliefs and if they’re tempered with the respect for dissenting views….
simon, your right it is not serious political debate, because Ron Paul is not a serious candidate.
“Going against the crowd takes bravery” I totally agree, and that is what George Bush has done all along. Leadership. He is attacked constantly and still stays the course. Lincoln was hated as well during the Civil War and he defined leadership.
Sprite, A poem from me to you our athiest pen pal…
The road(s) to heaven/utopia are littered with scriptures and manifestos
Once you reach your summit you’ve only caught a peak
Heaven/Utopia lies well beyond that point
Your eyes and feet won’t get you there
Words will only take you back down
To pick up its scent you’ll need other senses
A sherpa can’t lead you
A man can’t carry you
Death merely returns you to base, where you can set out again
If you can carry one thing on your next trip
Don’t bring food or drink
Carry a note reminding you
The frozen relics and bodies you’ll see are evidence you’ve been there before and failed
Most importantly, you’ll know you’ve come to the right place
Only when friends and foes are there to greet you
Only then will all the summits become one
Deny the summit exists and you’ll continually wander this illusion we call life…🙂
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