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This came up in the discussion about US travel Warnings. I thought the comment that Ex Pats don’t have the right to complain about what is going on at home was rather insensitive and short sighted.
While I have not yet left the US, I plan to leave. I would like to sever my (tax) relationship with the US government but that is not possible without becoming a full citizen of another country AND denouncing ones US citizenship. You can leave but they want your tax money (or in the least all the paperwork) no matter where you go.
Besides the difficulty of actually severing your relationship with the USA there are the people one has left behind, family, friends, relatives. . . whom the politics at home still effect. AND there are the retirement funds and Social Security funds that are being raped and plundered through actions of the government. . .
Last, but not least, as long as an “Ex Pat” has an address in the US they can register and vote (if they want). In the last dozen elections I have only rarely voted FOR someone, mostly against. It is time we had the choice of NO-CONFIDENCE in US elections. We do not, it is either Evil-1 or Evil-2, or not voting at all.
[quote=”guru”]
While I have not yet left the US, I plan to leave. I would like to sever my (tax) relationship with the US government but that is not possible without becoming a full citizen of another country AND denouncing ones US citizenship. You can leave but they want your tax money (or in the least all the paperwork) no matter where you go.
Welcome to the Hotel IRS:
“You can check out any time you like, but you can never leave”I agree 100%
All of us expats have some kind of a connection “back home.”
I have family in the U.K and two U.S. born children attending U.S. universities and have every right to be concerned about their future in the world.
Unfortunately I do not believe your vote means anything at all…
I do believe that:
“If voting changed anything, they’d make it illegal,” said Emma Goldman over 100 years ago!
Elections, Goldman knew, consist primarily of “wire-pulling, intriguing, flattering, lying, cheating; in fact, chicanery of every description, whereby the political aspirant can achieve success. Added to that is a complete demoralization of character and conviction, until nothing is left that would make one hope for anything from such a human derelict. Time and time again the people were foolish enough to trust, believe, and support with their last farthing aspiring politicians, only to find themselves betrayed and cheated.”
[ http://www.counterpunch.org/2004/03/20/emma-goldman-for-president/ ]
“Patriotism requires allegiance to the flag, which means obedience and readiness to kill father, mother, brother, sister,” Emma wrote in 1910. “Patriotism assumes that our globe is divided into little spots, each one surrounded by an iron gate. Those who have had the fortune of being born on some particular spot, consider themselves better, nobler, grander, more intelligent than the living beings inhabiting any other spot. It is, therefore, the duty of everyone living on that chosen spot to fight, kill, and die in the attempt to impose his superiority upon all the others.”
This was in your referenced article Mr. Oliver. Well here we go again. Simply amazing. Why can’t you just stick to the name of your site and stop the endless dribble? You should be above this.
[quote=”MsKitty”]”Patriotism requires allegiance to the flag, which means obedience and readiness to kill father, mother, brother, sister,” Emma wrote in 1910. “Patriotism assumes that our globe is divided into little spots, each one surrounded by an iron gate. Those who have had the fortune of being born on some particular spot, consider themselves better, nobler, grander, more intelligent than the living beings inhabiting any other spot. It is, therefore, the duty of everyone living on that chosen spot to fight, kill, and die in the attempt to impose his superiority upon all the others.”
This was in your referenced article Mr. Oliver. Well here we go again. Simply amazing. Why can’t you just stick to the name of your site and stop the endless dribble? You should be above this.[/quote]
It is amazing isn’t it?
Makes perfect sense to me MsKitty and you will not tell me what to do!
If you don’t like what I write or what I refer to then don’t read it! Real simple…
PS. And, I believe you’re searching for the word ‘drivel’ rather than dribble, no?
it’s hardly dribble to understand the far-reaching grasp of US imperialistic politics even though many of us live outside the US.
Sounds like Ms Kitty is looking for a place where brainwashed low grade morons from the US will rubber stamp her warped world view and belief in that ridiculous concept of American Exceptionalism. The view that the US is qualitatively superior to all other nations is as insane as any of the religious fanatics out there strapping bombs to their bodies.
[quote=”maravilla”]it’s hardly dribble to understand the far-reaching grasp of US imperialistic politics even though many of us live outside the US.[/quote]
The gravest error in the past century was the conservative idea that the U.S. could accomplish nation building in two nations that were created by drawing lines in the sand without considering the religious and ethnic makeup of the populations within those borders.
The fact of the matter is that both Afghanistan and Iraq will revert to what they were before the U.S. arrived as soon as the U.S. leaves.
At some stage, surely China, Pakistan and Russia (who are friendlier than ever) will draw their line in the sand? Don’t you think?
Before the ‘war’ broke out in Libya more than 35,000 Chinese were evacuated
According to: [ http://21stcenturywire.com/2011/04/12/2577/ ] West vs China: A New Cold War Begins. One only has to read the strategic briefings in U.S. AFRICOM documents to realise the true endgame in Libya: the control of valuable resources and the eviction of China from North Africa.
According to Bejing’s Ministry of Commerce, China’s current contracts in Libya number no less than 50 large projects involving contracts in excess of 18 billion USD. What is even more revealing here is that due to the recent instability in the North African region, China’s investments have taken a serious hit. The recent political turmoil in the region has caused China’s foreign contracted projects to drop with new contracts amounting to $3,470,000,000, down 53.2%. Among them, the amount of new contracts in Libya, down by 45.3%, 13.9% less turnover; to Algeria, the amount of the contract fell 97.1%, turnover decreased by 10.7% – all within the first 2 months of this year.
According to: [ http://www.thedailybell.com/3139/NATO-Preps-for-World-War ] NATO Preps for World War?
“China has attempted to warn Russia of US and NATO plans to initiate a global armed conflict. This conflict has reportedly moved from the drawing board to an activation stage. According to both Chinese and Russian Intelligence Sources, the US and NATO plans include among other, the deliberate implosion of the US- and EU Economies, destroying the worlds financial systems, and the launching of a massive conventional war throughout North America, Africa and Asia, as well as the Middle East. The war plans include the release of biological warfare agents designed to kill millions if not billions of people. The NATO strategists rely on their ability to sue for peace when the coming conflict is at its highest, to call for the establishment of a “New World Order” under the pretext of preventing the destruction of the planet and civilization as we know it.”
The line in the sand will be drawn at some stage in the not so distant future, the question is will the U.S. be foolish enough to cross that line?
If past performance is any indication of future results… Of course they will …
Do expats living in Costa Rica have a right to care about the increasingly high probability of a nuclear confrontation that could annihilate millions of people? Damned right we do …
[quote=”Scott”] According to: [ http://21stcenturywire.com/2011/04/12/2577/ ] West vs China: A New Cold War Begins.[/quote]
Do an internet search for [b]Dr. “Christof” Lehmann bio[/b] and you will find that all of the Libertarian web sites are quoting one source that has [b]an opinion[/b]. The only bio that seems to be available is his own self-proclaimed biography found at The 4th Media web site: [url=http://en.m4.cn/category/christof-lehmann/]Christof Lehmann[/url]
I have not found any other confirmation of his background.
[quote=”Scott”][ http://www.thedailybell.com/3139/NATO-Preps-for-World-War ] NATO Preps for World War?[/quote]
[b]Each of us has our own opinion so here is mine in response.[/b]
[quote=”Scott”]The line in the sand will be drawn at some stage in the not so distant future, the question is will the U.S. be foolish enough to cross that line?[/quote]
The line in the sand has already been drawn. This is not a military confrontation however, it is economic and so far, the U.S. has failed to find a way to level the playing field. Those who hold power worldwide are not about to destroy the very source of their power, consumers, in a military conflagration
One thing is certain. The current U.S. congress is embroiled in ideological warfare and proving to be incapable of agreeing to the very simple solutions to the economic recession in the U.S. Until they do the economy will continue its downward economic spiral.
Although moderates comprise the vast majority of America’s voters the far fringe of both progressive and conservative political thinking has hijacked the political process. The solution to this situation requires that the moderate majority start paying attention to what is happening, vote the fringe ideologues out of office and replace them with moderates who can compromise and move forward.
[quote=”Scott”]Do expats living in Costa Rica have a right to care about the increasingly high probability of a nuclear confrontation that could annihilate millions of people? Damned right we do …[/quote]
This does not affect only expats, it has an effect on the entire planet. The OWS protests have moved from a few individuals on Wall Street to a global protest movement within a month and a half. These citizens realize that the ideological standoff cannot continue without major economic harm.[quote=”waggoner41″]Those who hold power worldwide are not about to destroy the very source of their power, consumers, in a military conflagration
[/quote]Waggoner, you are making the mistake of believing that the power holders are as rational as you are and that they share your humane goals. There is ample historic evidence that they are definitely not rational and not humane.
It is quite possible that those in power have every intention of culling the herd to more manageable numbers. The US has used nuclear bombs in the past to resolve military problems. Recent behavior by those who control things indicates that they are inclined to take even more insane actions today than in the past.
Forget about the puppet show being put on for you in Washington. Don’t waste your time and energy participating in the false two party paradigm. Follow the money to the source if you want an idea as to who is doing what and why.
We might care what’s going on… but can we really change it? I think the path to ruin was set upon MANY years ago, and those choices are now coming home to roost! Nothing is going to stop it… not a business surge… green economy.. or the second coming of Jesus! 🙂
Wars and conflicts are just a distraction from the real root of the problem in the US.
No need to look at what politicians are doing today… they’re dead men walking… they’re just too stupid to know it! The current economic disaster is the the result of social engineering started 60 years ago with the new deal and every other social program that rewarded folks for not talking responsibility for themselves and the mouths they brought into the world!. It’s created a “lifestyle” and sense of entitlement that has expanded to the point of taking our system down!
Want to know why the middle class can’t pull us out of this mess this time? Because the lower class has expanded at a rate twice that of those paying the bills! And their demands have now overwhelmed our system. No I’m not talking about the middle class talking the one two punch into poverty…. nope… just the birth rate of those least able to support themselves or contribute to the tax base!
In New York… 51% of the children born have their birth paid for by Medicaid… and you can only guess where the expenses go from there. What does that tell you? Is this a sustainable business model? And please don’t say it all the more reason we need Obamacare… seems if you can’t afford to have children you should perhaps NOT until you’re able to afforded to! And if you can’t pay for the birth, I’m guessing the expenses of raising a child will be well out of reach as well! But have no fear… you have a rich Uncle… his name is Sam… or at least he WAS rich… seems that extended family have put a real drain on his finances! Heck… he’s always bailed us out before… but I think his accounts are empty and his ability to borrow is now in question!
The well published fact that 44%-47% of folks don’t pay ANY Federal tax has been around for a while. But did you know that a large percentage of folks that don’t pay ANY tax get a “refund” from Uncle Sam when they file their “tax return”…. yep… The Earned income credit… which is nothing more than another hand out which REWARDS those of limited income that choose to bring more mouths into the world and expand the lower class (no dig… but if I’m middle class and Warren Buffet is Upper Class then the term does seem correct)… that’s right… have another kid you can’t afford and your “refund” goes up!
Every society makes mistakes… look at what’s going on in China right now with the one child policy… besides all the evils we’ve seen since it started… children murdered, abortions forced on women, girls abandoned or “given” away for adoption, parents punished for breaking the rules even when they could afford a second child…
Suddenly the great thinkers in China are confronted with an aging population where there is only one child to support a pair of parents and grand parents… all this “engineering” coming home to make for a real mess of Chinese society in the next two decades!
We in the US and other “advanced and progressive” counties are now paying the price (and will crash eventually) as a result of the tolerance of a society that refuses to place personal responsibility on those that chose not to contribute yet feel entitled to take and expand society’s obligations.
Margaret Thatcher said it best…. and I’m para-phasing since the quote has taken many forms over the years but you’ll get the idea. It goes something like this… “The problem with socialism is that at some point you run out of other people’s money!”
In the US we’re paying the price now… besides trying to be the world’s voice of “freedom”… and police at the same time. We’ve created our own path to ruin with a lot of folks that think they have a RIGHT to everything… and they have insured those rights by bringing a bunch more folks into the world that were born into, and raised with this same belief! Much like a Ponzi scheme, this one has run it’s course… time to run…
[quote=”guru”]This came up in the discussion about US travel Warnings. I thought the comment that Ex Pats don’t have the right to complain about what is going on at home was rather insensitive and short sighted.
While I have not yet left the US, I plan to leave. I would like to sever my (tax) relationship with the US government but that is not possible without becoming a full citizen of another country AND denouncing ones US citizenship. You can leave but they want your tax money (or in the least all the paperwork) no matter where you go.
Last, but not least, as long as an “Ex Pat” has an address in the US they can register and vote (if they want). In the last dozen elections I have only rarely voted FOR someone, mostly against. It is time we had the choice of NO-CONFIDENCE in US elections. We do not, it is either Evil-1 or Evil-2, or not voting at all.[/quote]
Ex-Pat’s from the Nation they left have the rights of the Citizenship of the original country but not the right to particapate in the elections and discorse of that Nation they left. Of course if you have a residence in your origianal Nation and citizenship you can vote but not if you sell and move abroad, you have surrendered your right to vote.
ALSO; as an EX-Pat you have residency but not citizanship in that foreign country and cannot vote.
You can’t have it both ways. I can vote in the USA because I have a residency in the USA but my wife has a green card and she cannot vote. When we go to CR my wife can vote but I cannot and we have a house (a residence) in CR but I am not a citizen of CR.
You can worry all you want but as an Ex-Pat you cannot vote in either country. A tourist can go back to his country and vote, a person that sold everything in his country and moved to another is an Ex-Pat and ineligeble to vote in his country or the country he decides to live out side his citizenship and place of residence.
Are you a Tourist or an Ex-pat?? BIG difference
So if I rented an apartment my whole life in the US… and therefore nothing to “sell”… then moved to CR I can’t vote in the US? I think you’re mistaken on this one… as a US citizen… and a TAXPAYER (not required to vote by the way!)… you have the right to vote! Not that it matters much… nor should you really care much if you were smart enough to escape! LOL
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