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[quote=”sweikert925″]I don’t know you well enough to say whether or not you are a racist. But it was you who brought up the subject of race – not I – even though it had NOTHING to do with Nicaragua, or Daniel Ortega, or the Sandinistas, or programs for the poor in Nicaragua, or a proposed canal in Nicaragua, or the Chinese building a canal there.
Absolutely nothing.
As for my question, I will note your response as “declines to answer”.[/quote]
Unfortunately, as we know by the numbers, race does have somewhat of a correlation to economics. As does sex, education, martial status, and geographic location in some situations.
As to the relevance to the Nicaragua situation it has to do with how Danny got elected, and how he stays in power. Both he and Hugo targeted minority and the underclass voters in their rise to power. Both presidents of the people that quickly removed the controls that were in place to keep dictatorships from taking hold.
It’s the new path politicians take to office. And it should scare the hell out of people. You would think people would have learned after Hitler pulled something very similar. Difference was Hitler has appealing to a beaten down people. It took a while for the underclass to expand in the rest of the world for politicians to realize they could use the same playbook over the last 20 years or so.
While I can’t say I declined to answer your question I chose not to use a word implying finality. Is it possible yes. Is it likely, not in my opinion.
Unless there is a MAJOR change in society I dont see the tread changing it’s current path. That applies to both politics in south and central America as well as the US.
Am I to take it your not going to attempt to challenge my position with any other groups other than Asian and West Virgina voters? LOL
BTW. I’m taking a guess here but I’m thinking there are more folks on food stamps (straight numbers not percentages of total population) in NYC or Chicago then there are in all of West Virginia. Statistics are a funny thing you can make them say just about anything you want to make your point.
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]
Check on the voting figures by race and how they voted and tell me that what we’re seeing is within statistical norms or defendable as informed voters making a conscious decision to vote for the most qualified candidate…The underclass have become a voting force that candidates now chase. [/quote]I can’t believe you’re equating “underclass” with “race”. That says something about your attitudes and I’m sorry to say it isn’t very complimentary. OK, here’s a racial statistic with regard to voting:
“…[C]onsider the votes of another minority — Asians. Romney won among all voters making more than $100,000 a year by a margin of 54-44. Asian-Americans happen to be the highest-earning group in the U.S., out-earning whites, and they generally place enormous emphasis on family. A perfect fit for Republicans, no? No. Asians voted for Obama by 73-26; they were more Democratic than Hispanics.”
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-11-08/asian-voters-send-a-message-to-republicans.html
Here’s another statisic that may be relevant: in 1960, JFK won 78% of the vote among Catholics. Among Irish Catholics it was almost certainly higher but I couldn’t find a source for that. So the percentage of blacks voting for Obama may be an indication of something other than “what’s in it for me?”, don’t you think?
Finally, West Virginia has one of the highest rate of food stamp and welfare payments yet it voted for Romney 62% to 36% and they tend to vote more Republican every election.
Your attitude about race and voting is a perfect example of why Republicans have a hard time attracting black voters – you assume they are all welfare-addicted “low information” voters who only vote to get stuff. They tend to get that – they’re not as stupid as you seem to think.
But we’ve strayed too far off the subject of Nicaragua and the proposed canal, so I’ll just ask you straight out: Will Cuba, Venezuela and Nicaragua ever have right wing governments again or not?[/quote]
Perhaps I was a bit hasty in my efforts to stop insulting you! LOLSo you’re now implying (or did you out and out say it) that I’m a racist? I’m not sure if I’m more hurt by that or that you imply I’m also Republican! For the record I’m neither.
The underclass is a group which represents a wide band of our society. And as such nearly mirrors the ethnic and racial make-up of society for the most part. Accordingly whites make up the largest percentage currently. And as I will freely admit that I am in fact white it’s truly a stretch to call me a racist.
What I do find funny and perhaps an indicator of your leanings and racial issues slant is that you picked Asians to make your point. Perhaps one of the smallest groups to target to debate the issue or attempt to make your point. You seemed to have completely ignore, perhaps intentionally, perhaps not, black voters which make up both a much larger percentage of the population and voting pool. And therefore are much more statistically significant to the issue of how and why people vote the way they do.
Can you provide us with some of your internet wizardry to support your position if you us black voters to make the same point? I already know the answer but perhaps you’d like to try. Our readers might enjoy the exercise.
You can skip the race baiting. I’m well trained in avoiding it. Facts are key. And the numbers don’t lie.
When politicians get elected through the efforts of groups like ACORN (now history) that target a specific group of voters to advance their political future no one wins. When folks aren’t concerned or intelligent enough to get involved in the political process and are instead “guided” by such groups in their vote we’re headed for real trouble.
As to your question…. you used the word EVER…. as in FOREVER….. or NEVER! Very strong words that have a finality to them. And as we both know, using such words isn’t a great idea…. especially when applying them to the actions, or potential actions, of humans.
[quote=”sweikert925″]
I suppose I should be grateful that at least imxploring no longer feels the need to insult me when he disagrees with me about something, so maybe there’s hope for some of the rest of you.[/quote]
Hey, I’m still working on bending your mind….. insulting you was just to get your full attention! LOL 🙂
BTW… Unfortunately I see the weather warmed up in your neck of the woods this past weekend. Truly a sign that society is on the edge and that the path is going to be a bumpy one!
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]
This is how leaders get elected these days…. you appeal to the underclass… they’re a political force by virtue of having expanded their voter base while enjoying the fruits of a welfare society. And political leaders love it! These folks are easily manipulated and far from being smart enough to see that promises and programs can never be delivered. Nor do they seem to care. Instant gratification is much more important.
[/quote]If what you’re saying is that peoople tend to vote in a way that advances their own selfish interests then I agree, but that’s true for both sides of the political divide. That’s just human nature. And your condescension toward left leaning voters is pretty crass. Not “smart enough”? Really! There are some pretty dumb members on the right last time I looked too. I don’t see that either side has a monopoly on low-information voters.
Your conclusion that it means there is a permanent left majority due to the social welfare programs is false. First of all the numbers of people who benefit from what you would call welfare is pretty tiny. Romney’s “47%” comment only corresponds to reality if it includes those who get Social Security and Medicare and that group of people are the most right leaning voter bloc there is. Even some of the people who get direct welfare payments vote Republican.
Wasn’t it Ronald Reagan who promised to roll back the welfare state and yet was elected president twice, the second time with one of the greatest landslides in US poltical history? (Of course he DIDN’T actually do much to roll it back, but that’s because he was smarter than most people gave him credit for at the time, including me).
So to conclude that Nicaragua is a permanent left wing country is simply wrong, no matter how many programs are in place to cater to the poor. Cuba, Nicaragua and Venezuela will all have right wing governments again someday.[/quote]
Unfortunately the recent phenomenon I’m referencing isn’t contained in Central America. Reagan’s election is a bit too far back in history to apply to debunking my statement. Go do a little research on the voting trends in the last two presidential elections in the US and check the voting figures by precentage and race. And how they voted. You might even be able to find some numbers on social economic voting treads.
What you will find is that larger and larger segments of society are voting in very clear trends. Trends that have NOTHING to do with the best or most qualified candidate. And while you and others will argue that this has always been the trend, that folks vote for the candidate that they think will do best for THEIR own needs, it is now far beyond that. Check on the voting figures by race and how they voted and tell me that what we’re seeing is within statistical norms or defendable as informed voters making a conscious decision to vote for the most qualified candidate.
The underclass have become a voting force that candidates now chase. It use to be contained to pockets in the inner cities. I use to watch as local candidates in these areas would help them to fill out the voter registration forms at the local hangouts with free food and drinks. Then on election day have buses with the same free goodies pick them up and drive them to the voting location giving them a sheet with all the candidates to vote for. THIS is a first hand experience, not something imagined or found on the internet! It wasn’t on the national level at that point, I’m talking about 28 years ago in the worst parts of NYC.
Now we have the same thing happening on the national level. And it is accelerating to the point that, as we have seen in south and central America, candidates now chase this voting block as a power base. With 45 million folks in the US on food stamps (I believe that’s the number off the top of my head) you have nicely defined voting block to go after that are willing to vote for anyone that promises them anything, even if it can’t be delivered. Are these REALLY the folks we want shaping the future of our country through the people they elect?
[quote=”costaricafinca”]One mustn’t forget to take with you in a CAJA hospital, your own pillow, linens, PJ’s, soap, and towels…and make sure you have someone to take them home to be laundered.
Also one must arrange for a ‘visitor’ to be there, covering a 24 hour period, to help you to the washroom, feed you as there is[u] never enough staff[/u] nor ‘volunteer groups’ who step up to help the nursing staff.[/quote]Basic care at the local clinics (out patient) is not bad. Sort of like the urgent care centers (we call them Doc in a box in the states) common in the US. That is if they’re open and have staff. The area hospital, in the case of folks in our area, in Canas is good for care beyond what is available at the clinic and many emergencies that don’t require ongoing treatment or hospitalization. Several folks I know have had very good experiences with the care but none was facing anything that serious or something that required hospitalization. The availabilty of medical advice and medications (some only available thru a doctor visit in the US) at the local pharmacy is wonderful.
Thankfully between the care at the pharmacy and clinic 95% of most needs can be addressed.
But once again, nothing overall that one should be forced into paying $500/ month for out of their retirement income for.
[quote=”costaricabill”][quote=”sweikert925″]I think you’re being too pessimistic. The Nicaraguans threw the Sandanistas out once before and I suspect they will eventually do so again. Any new right wing government is then more likely to cozy back up the US, or at least become somewhat less cozy to the Chinese.[/quote]
Sweikert – you are showing, once again, your lack of knowledge with how things are done and what is happening and what has happened in Central American countries – in this case, Nicaragua.
Are you aware that the Nicaragua Constitution precluded a president from succeeding him/herself? Are you aware that Ortega has run in every presidential election since 1984 and he is now in his second term having been re-elected in 2011.How did that happen? Simple…..
[i]During an interview with David Frost for the Al Jazeera English programme Frost Over The World in March 2009, Ortega suggested that he would like to change the constitution to allow him to run again for president.[49] In Judicial Decision 504, issued on October 19, 2009, the Supreme Court of Justice of Nicaragua declared portions of Articles 147 and 178 of the Constitution of Nicaragua inapplicable; these provisions concerned the eligibility of candidates for President, Vice-President, Mayor, and Vice-Mayor.[50] For this decision, the Sandinista magistrates formed the required quorum by excluding the opposition magistrates and replacing them with Sandinista substitutes, violating the Nicaraguan constitution.[51] The decision was widely denounced by the opposing parties, the church and human rights groups in Nicaragua.[/i]October 19, 2009 was on a Monday – Ortega had called the Supreme Court of Justice into session on Sunday the 18th (with advance planning of course) and had them change the Constitution!
So don’t start spouting off about “The Nicaraguans threw the Sandanistas (sic) out once before and I suspect they will eventually do so again” without any knowledge of how things CAN’T get done.
Once he saw how Hugo did it in Venezuela, he took good notes and followed the same pathway.[/quote]
Same game the former president (another Hugo clone) of Honduras tried a few years back. Unfortunately for him he telegraphed his moves and the folks in his country (including the Supreme court and military) were smart enough and saw where it was headed and put a quick stop to it! They loaded him on a plane at gun point and shipped him off for a involuntary vacation in CR. It was funny when he showed up in CR wearing pajamas and slippers claiming he wasn’t trying to do what everyone knew he was!
I remember the conversations we had here at that time! Such good times! LOL
[quote=”sweikert925″]I think you’re being too pessimistic. The Nicaraguans threw the Sandanistas out once before and I suspect they will eventually do so again. Any new right wing government is then more likely to cozy back up the US, or at least become somewhat less cozy to the Chinese.[/quote]
Come now my friend… you forget! This is the “new” face of the Sandanistas. A party of the people, for the people! Cut from the same cloth as our departed friend Hugo. Operating by the same political playbook! Looking out for the little guy, the poor, the oppressed, the illiterate, and the disenfranchised! After all they all get to vote…. even if they can’t read or have ever spent a day working to support themselves!
This is how leaders get elected these days…. you appeal to the underclass… they’re a political force by virtue of having expanded their voter base while enjoying the fruits of a welfare society. And political leaders love it! These folks are easily manipulated and far from being smart enough to see that promises and programs can never be delivered. Nor do they seem to care. Instant gratification is much more important.
Come to think or it, the current administration of the US isn’t far removed from having used the same method of getting elected. And it will only get worse from here… exponentially in fact…
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]
The $1000 number is way too low to honestly live in CR unless you’re going to adopt a Tico/Campesino lifestyle. So that’s not really a plus for those believing they can make it in CR with that level of income unless they are also drawing down on a nice nestegg as well. [/quote]Whether it is [b]wise[/b] to try to live on $1000/month wasn’t the point, you asked me for an example of how Costa Rica was offering inducements to retirees and I gave you one. But since you raise the subject it is certainly easier to live on $1000/month in CR than it would be in the US.
CR does offer special consideration to high income residents through the inversionista program. You may not think they offer enough under that to induce very many high income expatriates but you can’t deny that they do have some type of program in place to lure them.
[/quote]Agreed… $1000 goes further in CR. But even when they upped it from $600 the new number was unrealistic. An inducement that is unrealistic really can’t be counted as one. In some ways it’s a trap. Reality would be a better start if CR is looking to attract retirees with a chance of making it in a reasonable fashion that don’t end up having a very bad experience in relocating to CR. George will give you the good, the bad, and the ugly so you will know what I’m talking about.
The investor program does provide another avenue, however, we still have not gotten an answer on CAJA participation and rate. That makes a big difference. Also the investment of $200k or more in what might be a less than liquid investment is VERY different than the commitment/risk which a pension applicant makes with residency.
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]
I’ll leave you and the rest of the members of this community to connect the dots and make their own judgement on the issue.[/quote]I did connect the dots and did make my own judgment. Now please answer my question: What is it the US should be doing about this?[/quote]
Very little the US can do as far as the Nicaragua situation. We closed that particular door years ago when we picked sides and watched as Danny came back to haunt us. So that one’s a lost cause for the US and the Chinese knew it. In war you probe your enemies lines and strike where they’re weakest, thus using the minimal amount of resources and manpower to achieve your objective. That’s all the Chinese did in Nicaragua. They probably could have promised Dan a lollipop or an ice cream cone and it was a done deal!
What Nicaragua and Danny got out of the deal was a “possible” investment and some nice time in the press that didn’t involve an earthquake and 200 dead! All some nice stuff Danny will use at home to convince folks that Nicaragua is actually on the world map still! Much like Hugo use to like to do… it’s all about perception and keeping your people thinking you have a plan, have their best interest at heart, and that what you’re doing ultimately will benefit them!
As to what the US can and should be doing… that’s a tough call because it requires MONEY….. the Chinese have ours…. we don’t…. and they need to spend it. So other than photo ops and state dinners there’s not much the US can do!
Nicaragua was a unique situation based on prior US involvement with players that are still in the game.
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]
What do you consider the “generous inducements” these days?
[/quote]The ability to qualify for pensionado status with only $1000 of guaranteed income and the ability to buy into CAJA (though we seem to have a profound disagreement on that). Very few nations offer anything that generous to prospective retirees.
With regard to your comment about baby boomers as the “bulk market” – it may be that they want some US retirees relocating there but not hordes of them. If that’s true then their reduction of the inducements makes perfect sense.[/quote]
Once again some disagreement with your views…. friendly in nature. 🙂
The $1000 number is way too low to honestly live in CR unless you’re going to adopt a Tico/Campesino lifestyle. So that’s not really a plus for those believing they can make it in CR with that level of income unless they are also drawing down on a nice nestegg as well. Nor is it an advantage to the government of CR. Given the choice one would have to believe that if they truly don’t want “hordes” seeking retirement in CR that they would be more inclined to seek higher net worth retirees that would not likely have to compete in the job market in CR to make it (illegally) when relocating to CR. Nor do I believe they want people that will be a drain on the system as we have discussed with CAJA.
We can both agree that while you see the “ability” to join CAJA as an advantage, perhaps based on your projected retirement income and the small fee should your income be very close to the minimum required for residency. I see the REQUIREMENT of MANDATORY participation in CAJA as a major disadvantage based on the ROI I would receive on the level of premium I would be forced to pay for a plan I most likely would not use.
This also brings up investment and job creation by retirees of differing income levels. If CR was thinking this through they would know that higher income retirees with more disposable income create jobs and spend money on more than just scrapping by. Unfortunately the same cannot be said of someone that perhaps meets the bare minimum requirements for residency that is left with $870/ month to spend living after they are forced to contribute to CAJA.
This isnt a dig on anyone or class warfare…. just reality and economics. As for CR’s moves making “perfect sense”…. live here a while and try using that term in regards to the way this government, or for that fact ANY government, operates!!!!
Hopefully the next president sees the fantastic potential and the current problems and addresses both before it’s too late!
[quote=”srigsby”]Does anyone know what the consequence is for not paying the corporation taxes? I have a corp, which is labeled active and there is nothing being held in this corp. It was the original one we used to buy land but the land has been sold and we still hold the corporation. I was told by the attorney that they can dissolve it, of course, for a fee, but I was also told it would dissolve itself if the corp taxes were not paid for 3 or so years. I do have another corp, which is inactive that holds our new property.[/quote]
Do it the right way and have an attorney close it for you now. The cost won’t be crazy and the possibility of some unanticipated consequence hitting you down the road will be removed! You’ll sleep better with a minimal expense.
Better to deal with it now than wonder when and IF it will “resolve” itself because you fail to pay a tax! That’s never a good idea.
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]
There are a number of advantages to CR that one by one seem to be disappearing. Luckily some of us will not need or be required to seek residency. The ability to spend part of your retirement in CR is still attractive, however, for folks that must “put all their eggs in one basket” and relocate to CR completely the advantages and costs are not as attractive as they once were. Our longtime retirees and those that have watched over a period of time as the incentives and benefits have slowly eroded can confirm this I’m sure! Really a shame the folks in charge in CR don’t see that!
[/quote]I suspect that the government of CR still values having expatriates relocate to CR or they wouldn’f offer such generous inducments to do so. The fact that they aren’t as generous as they once were is certainly troubling both the current resident gringos and prospective ones such as myself. But the government of CR can’t be expected to cater to foreign nationals wanting to relocate, their priority should (and no doubt is) what is best for Costa Ricans. I think they’re a better judge of what that is than you or I.
It could be that they offered very generous inducements initially to get noticed as a retirement haven and now that they are they feel they can cut back a bit on the inducements and still get people to relocate there. Anyone who has studied marketing knows what I’m talking about. When you introduce a new product keep the price as low as possible (maybe even below production costs if you can) and then raise the price as your market share increases.
But maybe not. Maybe they are killing the goose that lays the golden eggs and aren’t even aware they’re doing it. Who’s to say.[/quote]
Two issues with your statement….
What do you consider the “generous inducements” these days?
And
With marketing you don’t raise your prices or lessen the attractiveness of your product just when the BULK of your target market (in this case folks entering retirement, baby boomers) are coming into the market. That’s when you grab market share.
If CR is following your path they jumped the gun a bit on monetizing the retirement bubble. The information age makes it too easy to “shop” for the best price and value these days in real-time. Looking at many of the sources for retirement information and advice they often skip CR as a place to consider. Some I agree with on the issues raised, others I do not.
We each must weigh all the available information and see how it dovetails with our needs, expectations, and resources.
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]
If Nicaragua is so far away and of little apparent importance to the US why did we spend all that time, money, and effort involving ourselves in their politics when Danny was the rebel not a world leader?
[/quote]You know it’s getting REALLY annoying that people keep putting words in my mouth when I have never said anything like what they insist I did. I never said that Nicaragua was of little apparent importance, I just said it wasn’t the backyard of the US – meaning it dos not in any way “belong” to us. And I further said that whether or not they build a canal is their business, not ours. If you feel that having a Chinese built canal there (which consensus opinion says will never happen anyway) is a threat to the US then please explain why. And what is it that the US should be doing about it?
[/quote]
Three words as to why Chinese involvement in Nicaragua SHOULD be of importance to the US and expats looking to CR as a retirement location as well as those already here…. Influence, Favor, and Control.
I’ll leave you and the rest of the members of this community to connect the dots and make their own judgement on the issue.
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”johnnyh”]…because this canal project is huge, and in our own backyard.[/quote]
Nicaragua is no more our backyard than Canada is our front yard. It is actually a whole separate country unconnected to the US of A. If they want to build a canal across their country we have absolutely nothing to say about it, any more than Nicaragua has a say about whatever canals the US decides to build.[/quote]
If Nicaragua is so far away and of little apparent importance to the US why did we spend all that time, money, and effort involving ourselves in their politics when Danny was the rebel not a world leader?
The world is a LOT smaller place than you seem to think. And the actions and politics of countries far from our boarders have more to do with our politics back home than you may think.
“RISK” isn’t just an old style board game to some folks.
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]
Unfortunately I know quite a few people with rather great pensions (in your opinion) that are in no rush to give up 13% (if that is in fact the number CR is now requiring for CAJA and residency) of their gross income for a plan they will most likely not use. Myself included. CAJA cannot even be compared to private care in CR nor is it anywhere near the care one can get in the US for the treatment of serious illness.
[/quote]If someone having THAT high a pension is really that bothered by paying 13% to CAJA then I would wonder why they would even consider retiring to CR. There are other places where the climate is just as nice and there is no socialized medicine.
[quote=”imxploring”]
Comparing the premiums for insurance issued by a US based company against an arbitrarily imposed percentage of income for a public health service does both an injustice! It’s like comparing pineapples and bananas! LOL
[/quote]No, it’s not. While Cigna is a US insurer, the quote is specifically for [b]private care administered in CR[/b], not for care in the US. If the quote was for US care, it would be MUCH higher.
[quote=”imxploring”]
After all the information you have obtained about CAJA can you honestly tell us that if you found out you had a life threatening brain tumor five years after you’d relocated to CR, obtained your residency, and were using CAJA for your medical care that you wouldn’t return to the US for treatment?
[/quote]If the situation arose between the time I first retired at age 62 and the time I turned 65, then yes, absolutely, because I would have no other option. Even at the lower private cost of medical care in CR, I would probably not be able to afford to pay out of pocket for whatever brain tumor treatment might cost. After I turn 65 I do have the option of using Medicare in the US but the answer to your question is still probably yes, because even though the care might be mostly paid for by them, it wouldn’t be fully paid for and it’s unlikely I would have the money to pay whatever the difference is. Why should I automatically assume that whetever doctors treat my tumor in the US are better than any that might treat me in CR?
Your problem seems to be with medical care in Costa Rica generally rather than care available through CAJA because you frame the question as one of CR treatment vs US treatment. You automatically assume that US care will in all cases be better than care in CR. That may be true – but it may not.
[quote=”imxploring”]
If we are going to compare private health insurance premiums to the CAJA system then why should participation in CAJA be based on income rather than a fix premium? [/quote]As with the question I was asked recently about Obamacare, I’ll have to direct you to someone else. I had no input into how that decision was made nor any insight into why. But I advise against asking the US embassy staff – you’re likely to get “Idunno” LOL[/quote]
There are a number of advantages to CR that one by one seem to be disappearing. Luckily some of us will not need or be required to seek residency. The ability to spend part of your retirement in CR is still attractive, however, for folks that must “put all their eggs in one basket” and relocate to CR completely the advantages and costs are not as attractive as they once were. Our longtime retirees and those that have watched over a period of time as the incentives and benefits have slowly eroded can confirm this I’m sure! Really a shame the folks in charge in CR don’t see that!
As to the quality and availability of medical care comparing CR and the US…. that was a rhetorical question I hope! LOL
