[Imxploring]

[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”pixframe”]
Nice sound byte … but there are enough exceptions written in to Illinois’ law (and very intentionally written in) that can be manipulated to enable lifetime “membership” in your State’s welfare program. http://www.dhs.state.il.us/page.aspx?item=38464%5B/quote%5D

Here are those exceptions:

[i]Exceptions to the 60-month limit
A family might be able to receive more than the 60 months of TANF benefits if the parent:

Has a pending SSI application and is determined disabled by IDHS; or is determined unable to work at least 30 hours per week due to a medical condition; or

Is in an intensive program that prevents working at least 30 hours per week (includes DCFS, domestic violence, homeless services, mental health, substance abuse, and vocational rehabilitation programs); or

Is in an approved education or training program that will be finished within 6 months after the end of the 60 months; or

Is approved to care for a related child under 18 or spouse due to their medical condition; or

Has a disabled child under 21 who is approved for a Home and Community-based Care waiver.[/i]

Aside from the one that refers to a permanent disability, the others would be temporary in nature too. And the disability has to be of a nature that prevents someone from working – so just being in a wheelchair for example wouldn’t qualify.

Now I don’t know how many people are able to get past the 60 month limit based on these [b]AND NEITHER DO YOU.[/b][/quote]

Seems to be MORE than enough ways to make it possible to enjoy a lifetime on Welfare….so much for a real hard limit.

No wonder they all breed every other year and always have a child diagnosed with some type of alphabet disorder…. that is if they are are not using the same label themselves to keep the money coming in from the state.

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[quote=”costaricabill”]Sweikert –
Take a few deep breaths and relax, man. I can picture you just pounding away at your keyboard …. thump, thump, wham, wham, bang, bang!!

With that degree of angst, Costa Rica may not be your cup of tea. For the most part, those of us that are already here left that attitude at the border or stateside.

It seems to me that you are ready to pppppounce on just about any comment, statement or opinion, armed with the power of the internet to find a “fact” or “opinion” that backs you up.

So what? There are always other “facts” and “opinions” that will take the other side. Just because it is on the internet doesn’t mean that it is cast in stone.

Ask Al Gore – he’ll say the same thing and he invented the damn thing!

Give it a break!
Breathe…… relax…… tranquilo![/quote]

If in fact the move ever does happen I see a very short stay…. we haven’t even introduced him to “Tico Time” and “Gringo Pricing”…. and dealing with any form of government issues in CR will surely cause him to blow a seal!

He might not last through the trama of opening a bank account!

So what’s with those Yankees? LOL

[Imxploring]

[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]
And while they shorted the state pension system and the retirements of all those WORKING people for decades what did the total amount they were spending on welfare and social services spending do? Double? Triple? You know without having to look up the numbers that it didn’t go down!
[/quote]

Well it must be that you have the figures to back that up otherwise that would be just wild speculation and I’m sure you would NEVER resort to that right? Mind if I get a source for that statement then? Please tell us how you arrived at that “fact”.

[quote=”imxploring”]
I guess they were spending “other people’s” money and it ran out so they made a choice to not pay one bill to the detriment of others.[/quote]

On the contrary, the money was there all along to pay all of the state’s obligations – the gutless leaders in Springfield just chose not to raise the necessary taxes to do that.

[quote=”imxploring”]
I’d say that’s what Thatcher was referring to…..[/quote]

Then apparently you have a severe lack of understanding of her comment[/quote]

I’ll stick with my statement that social service spending went WAY up over the SAME period (decades) that Illinois was using OTHER people’s money (pension contributions which were thoseafter all part of each employee’s compensation for WORKING) to fund those increases. No internet references needed.

If money and wealth are from an infinite source they wouldn’t have any value. Something the Federal reserve is currently on the path to proving in the case of the US Dollar. More importantly when it comes to wealth and socialism, at some point the ability of government to tax the people fades and the willingness of those working that are supporting the system meets resistance. That happens long before the money runs out.

Common sense is a wonderful thing. Feel free to point to an an internet resource that trumps it.

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[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]
I’m sorry.. you’re right… all is well with the world and it’s current direction. No changes needed. No trouble on the horizon.

Welfare isn’t an ever expanding hole we keep throwing money into with no hope of changing it’s current direction. Social security is in great shape. Medicare is well funded and able to meet the future needs of those that were FORCED to participate and PAY into it just like Social Security. The national debt isn’t a problem…. after all we never have any intention or hope of ever paying it back! It’s just a pretend number.
[/quote]

I have never said anything even REMOTELY like any of that. I suppose its a measure of progress in our discourse that instead of resorting to insults when you run out reasoned argument you fall back on putting words in my mouth. But it’s still annoying.

[quote=”imxploring”]
Wake up my friend…. next you’ll be telling us and pointing to references that Illinois (your home state I believe) doesn’t have the WORSE funded state pension program in the country and is facing a MAJOR issue that will effect all the taxpayers in the Land of Lincoln.
[/quote]

Every public official in Illinois who was responsible for the fiscal mess that Illinois is in should go to jail. They deliberately shorted the pension funds for decades because they refused to either cut spending or raise taxes. (Until last year Illinois had one of the lowest income tax rates in the US, and even after they were raised we are not the highest). But that includes the 3 Republican governors who for 26 years straight held the governors office, from 1977-2003. George Ryan, the last Republican governor, IS in jail but not for that and the other 2 should join him.

Nice deflection on China and the one child policy but it has absolutely nothing to do with the topic under discussion. So I’ll ask the question again and dare you to answer it: Are Germany, Denmark, Sweden or China running out of money?[/quote]

And while they shorted the state pension system and the retirements of all those WORKING people for decades what did the total amount they were spending on welfare and social services spending do? Double? Triple? You know without having to look up the numbers that it didn’t go down!

I guess they were spending “other people’s” money and it ran out so they made a choice to not pay one bill to the detriment of others.

I’d say that’s what Thatcher was referring to…..

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[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]
You pointed to other counties and them not running out of money…. perhaps it’s because of the policies they have in place (as in China) that have created that money and preserved wealth? And do you think the US could ever hope to put those same policies in place now? With the portion of society in the US now feeding off the rest of us nothing short of a complete collapse will see that happening![/quote]

I would be absolutely thrilled to see the US adopt policies that are more like Germany’s, Denmark’s or Sweden’s. China, not so much. You do realize that all that wealth that China accumulated was due to a complete control of investment in industry by the central government right? That they stifle all dissent – not only political dissent but cultural and economic? Seems an odd choice for you to hold up as an example to follow.

I guess then your answer to my question “Are Germany, Denmark, Sweden or China running out of money?” is no then. And thus Margaret Thatcher’s comment is demonstrably wrong.[/quote]

You pointed to China as an example, not me. As for the rest you can’t use them as examples of sucessful socialist counties (evidenced by your point that they are not running out of money) without acknowledging the difference in their people, social services system, political structure, and tax rates.

You can’t possibly believe that such applies or could be applied in the US without major upheaval on both sides of the givers and takers?

MONEY AND WEALTH are not INFINITE. Therefore socialism with an ever expanding subculture cannot be supported indefinitely! The Iron Lady had it right. And time will be the true test of her statement.

The Myans, Romans, and even the Nazis thought they had it right and that their empires would stand the test of time and go on for 1000 years…. how’d that work out?

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[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”pixframe”]
Generational Welfare is alive and well. The major accomplishment of the Welform Reform Act you refer to is that it transferred the burden from the Federal government to the individual States.
[/quote]

I can’t comment about what other states do but in Illinois the traditional cash assistance that is generally referred to as welfare is also limited. There is a lifetime limit of 5 years. And to qualify for even that you must participate in a job program and demonstrate progress toward getting a job.[/quote]

Yeah…. that’s working out! Cash assistance, food assistance, housing assistance, medical assistance, heating assistance….etc….. add it all up. Not all end. And what is “demonstrated progress”…. seems rather subjective and proned to abuse. Kind of like “Workfare”….

Tell us about assistance to children? The same work around illegal aliens use to game the system….. sure mom and dad are illegal…. but as soon as they get here they start cranking out kids…. that by virtue of our silly laws are automatically American citizens and entitled to every benefit…. including social service benefits! Welfare works much the same way…. just another game have kids you can’t support and stay on the system.

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[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]
I’m sorry.. you’re right… all is well with the world and it’s current direction. No changes needed. No trouble on the horizon.

Welfare isn’t an ever expanding hole we keep throwing money into with no hope of changing it’s current direction. Social security is in great shape. Medicare is well funded and able to meet the future needs of those that were FORCED to participate and PAY into it just like Social Security. The national debt isn’t a problem…. after all we never have any intention or hope of ever paying it back! It’s just a pretend number.
[/quote]

I have never said anything even REMOTELY like any of that. I suppose its a measure of progress in our discourse that instead of resorting to insults when you run out reasoned argument you fall back on putting words in my mouth. But it’s still annoying.

[quote=”imxploring”]
Wake up my friend…. next you’ll be telling us and pointing to references that Illinois (your home state I believe) doesn’t have the WORSE funded state pension program in the country and is facing a MAJOR issue that will effect all the taxpayers in the Land of Lincoln.
[/quote]

Every public official in Illinois who was responsible for the fiscal mess that Illinois is in should go to jail. They deliberately shorted the pension funds for decades because they refused to either cut spending or raise taxes. (Until last year Illinois had one of the lowest income tax rates in the US, and even after they were raised we are not the highest). But that includes the 3 Republican governors who for 26 years straight held the governors office, from 1977-2003. George Ryan, the last Republican governor, IS in jail but not for that and the other 2 should join him.

Nice deflection on China and the one child policy but it has absolutely nothing to do with the topic under discussion. So I’ll ask the question again and dare you to answer it: Are Germany, Denmark, Sweden or China running out of money?[/quote]

So the bad choices in running the State Pension system warrant a jail sentence but the choices these same folks have made in state and federal policy (related to welfare spending) is Ok and sustainable? When WORKING people suffer and see their EARNED retirement lost…. then we’ll see some real change. The coming RETIREMENT CRISIS is just the latest nailin the coffin of this grand experiment!

You pointed to other counties and them not running out of money…. perhaps it’s because of the policies they have in place (as in China) that have created that money and preserved wealth? And do you think the US could ever hope to put those same policies in place now? With the portion of society in the US now feeding off the rest of us nothing short of a complete collapse will see that happening!

[Imxploring]

[quote=”pixframe”][quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]
Socialism for the benefit of those those currently in need is one thing.
[/quote]

Does that mean you have no problems with programs aimed at those “currently in need”? What exactly is your definition of “currently in need”?

[quote=”imxploring”]
Welfare spending (a truly detrimental form of socialism spending) continues to expand.
[/quote]

The only major expansion of social welfare spending over the past 20 years aside from the expansion of Medicaid that is part of the healthcare reform bill was the addition of a prescription drug benefit to Medicare. That was passed by a Republican Congress and pushed by a Republican president. It would have been a lot better if there had been the necessary raise in Medicare taxes to pay for it but instead the Republicans insisted that absolutely no additional funding to pay for it be in the bill. So every dollar paid out in benefits is added to the deficit – which is now being blamed on President Obama.

Prior to that, the welfare reform act of the mid 90s cut back on welfare spending and established a limit on how long someone can get assistance – so that the generational dependency you complain about would be eliminated. You can no longer be on traditional welfare assistance forever. Maybe that escaped your attention. (That change by the way is something I approve of both then and now). [/quote]

Generational Welfare is alive and well. The major accomplishment of the Welform Reform Act you refer to is that it transferred the burden from the Federal government to the individual States.
[/quote]

Well stated…. guess someone missed that point. Another unfunded mandate. Did anyone really think welfare was ended with the passage of a Federal bill?

[Imxploring]

[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”imxploring”]
Socialism for the benefit of those those currently in need is one thing.
[/quote]

Does that mean you have no problems with programs aimed at those “currently in need”? What exactly is your definition of “currently in need”?

[quote=”imxploring”] c.f.
Welfare spending (a truly detrimental form of socialism spending) continues to expand.
[/quote]

The only major expansion of social welfare spending over the past 20 years aside from the expansion of Medicaid that is part of the healthcare reform bill was the addition of a prescription drug benefit to Medicare. That was passed by a Republican Congress and pushed by a Republican president. It would have been a lot better if there had been the necessary raise in Medicare taxes to pay for it but instead the Republicans insisted that absolutely no additional funding to pay for it be in the bill. So every dollar paid out in benefits is added to the deficit – which is now being blamed on President Obama.

Prior to that, the welfare reform act of the mid 90s cut back on welfare spending and established a limit on how long someone can get assistance – so that the generational dependency you complain about would be eliminated. You can no longer be on traditional welfare assistance forever. Maybe that escaped your attention. (That change by the way is something I approve of both then and now).

It is true that since 2008 the number of people on SNAP (popularly known as food stamps) has gone up but that’s not because the eligibility rules have been relaxed. It is because 8 million people lost their jobs and had no alternative but to claim benefits if they wanted to feed their families. I wonder how many of them used to complain about the users and takers in society and how shameful it was they they were useless dead weight?

[quote=”imxploring”]
….and has now created a political base that is ever demanding in it’s needs.
[/quote]

Studies have shown that some of the very people who benefit from things like food stamps and the Earned Income Tax Credit vote Republican. States with the highest participation in those 2 programs tend to vote Republican. (Mississippi, Alabama, Louisiana). If you have a reliable source that shows that they all vote Democrat then please feel free to share it.

[quote=”imxploring”]
These same folks show little concern when expanding their subculture and bringing more children into the world while unable to support even themselves.
[/quote]

And yet Republicans are deadset against family planning, sex education, abortion and even, now, contraception. Go figure.

[quote=”imxploring”]
I don’t consider it silly when someone makes a common sense statement stating the obvious that money is a finite object
[/quote]

Money is an indicator of wealth and wealth is NOT a finite object. There is only so much to go around at any one given moment but that doesn’t mean it is finite.

Is Germany running out of money? Sweden? Denmark? China?[/quote]

I’m sorry.. you’re right… all is well with the world and it’s current direction. No changes needed. No trouble on the horizon.

Welfare isn’t an ever expanding hole we keep throwing money into with no hope of changing it’s current direction. Social security is in great shape. Medicare is well funded and able to meet the future needs of those that were FORCED to participate and PAY into it just like Social Security. The national debt isn’t a problem…. after all we never have any intention or hope of ever paying it back! It’s just a pretend number.

Wake up my friend…. next you’ll be telling us and pointing to references that Illinois (your home state I believe) doesn’t have the WORST funded state pension program in the country and is facing a MAJOR issue that will effect all the taxpayers in the Land of Lincoln. But these’s plenty of money out there to fix that…. we just print it up and poof…. our problem is gone….. right? Wealth after all, according to you, is infinite. But where in that belief does the unwillingness of those with wealth to continue to support those that choose not to contibute to the system come into your equation? It’s not a republican or democrat issue. It’s a common sense issue.

Funny you mention China…. perhaps if we imposed the one child policy on folks in the US including those on welfare…. or even better… a NO child policy if you can’t support another mouth to feed we’ll all be better off!

Let’s try imposing some of the policies in the countries you mentioned and see how the subculture reacts!

[Imxploring]

[quote=”sweikert925″]Margaret Thatcher said many silly things over the course of her political career but one of the silliest was “Socialist governments traditionally do make a financial mess. They always run out of other people’s money. It’s quite a characteristic of them.”

If you define socialist as any government that takes money from one group and gives it to another (which is wrong, but its how many conservatives seem to define it) then socialist governments have been around since governments were first established. The Sumerians, Egyptians, ancient Chinese, Romans – they all had governments that took from some to give to others. The only difference between then and now is that it used to be that money was taken from the poor and given to the rich. Nowadays that still happens, but we also have reversed the flow a bit to give some of it to the poor also.

One of the most strongly “socialist” governments is Germany’s yet they seem to have a very well run economy and don’t seem to be anywhere close to running out of money. In fact, their old age pension system has been around since the 1880s and they have very generous unemployment, health care, education, maternity leave and child care benefits – much more generous than in the US. The current unemployment rate in Germany, by the way, is 5.4%.

So as with almost all political thought that fits on a bumper sticker, “The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people’s money” is wrong.[/quote]

Socialism for the benefit of those those currently in need is one thing. Creating an ever expanding culture of entitlement without any effort by those receiving such assistance to contribute is the real problem. Welfare spending (a truly detrimental form of socialism spending) continues to expand. Many receiving it have a sense of entitlement, a mindset that has now become generational, and has now created a political base that is ever demanding in it’s needs. These same folks show little concern when expanding their subculture and bringing more children into the world while unable to support even themselves.

I don’t consider it silly when someone makes a common sense statement stating the obvious that money is a finite object (not that the Federal reserve believes that) that can never quench the needs of a policy/program that will continue to to expand in perpetuity.

[Imxploring]

[quote=”sweikert925″]Margaret Thatcher said many silly things over the course of her political career but one of the silliest was “Socialist governments traditionally do make a financial mess. They always run out of other people’s money. It’s quite a characteristic of them.”

If you define socialist as any government that takes money from one group and gives it to another (which is wrong, but its how many conservatives seem to define it) then socialist governments have been around since governments were first established. The Sumerians, Egyptians, ancient Chinese, Romans – they all had governments that took from some to give to others. The only difference between then and now is that it used to be that money was taken from the poor and given to the rich. Nowadays that still happens, but we also have reversed the flow a bit to give some of it to the poor also.

One of the most strongly “socialist” governments is Germany’s yet they seem to have a very well run economy and don’t seem to be anywhere close to running out of money. In fact, their old age pension system has been around since the 1880s and they have very generous unemployment, health care, education, maternity leave and child care benefits – much more generous than in the US. The current unemployment rate in Germany, by the way, is 5.4%.

So as with almost all political thought that fits on a bumper sticker, “The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people’s money” is wrong.[/quote]

Socialism for the benefit of those those currently in need is one thing. Creating an ever expanding culture of entitlement without any effort by those receiving such assistance to contribute is the real problem. Welfare spending (a truly detrimental form of socialism spending) continues to expand. Many receiving it have a sense of entitlement, a mindset that has now become generational, and has now created a political base that is ever demanding in it’s needs. These same folks show little concern when expanding their subculture and bringing more children into the world while unable to support even themselves.

I don’t consider it silly when someone makes a common sense statement stating the obvious that money is a finite object (not that the Federal reserve believes that) that can never quench the needs of a policy/program that will continue to to expand in perpetuity.

[Imxploring]

Margaret Thatcher said it best…. The problem with socialism is that at some point you run out of other people’s money!

The issue isn’t helping others in need. The real issue is when a subculture presents itself that expects to be serviced by the rest of society without any effort on their part to support the very system that provides for their existence. That is where the problem is, and the issue the US is facing and not dealing with. As this subculture expands and becomes a political force the transfer of wealth accelerates until those that are actually supporting the system revolt. That is where we are now. Government spending cannot go on uncontrollably without there being a serious impact on the taxpaying workers out there. Government spending is only masking the problems, delaying the needed social changes until it will be too late to fix them.

The Euro zone currently has an unemployment rate that will drag them under. The REAL unemployment rate in the US is doing the same!

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[quote=”kwhite1″][quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”kwhite1″]
There is nothing to worry about, the IRS is running Obamacare, I am positive they (IRS) know exactly how to run Obamacare with the least financial impact on you as possible.[/quote]

Actually it’s the Department of Health and Human Services that will be administering Obamacare, the only role the IRS will play is determining whether or not you have healthcare from your tax return and assessing the penalty if you don’t. But something tells me that isn’t going to reassure you very much.[/quote]

Well, that changes everything!! I feel very confident about it now (sarcasm off now).

Only the person that was in charge of the IRS targeting conservative groups at the time is in charge of the IRS part in Obamacare.

Help me understand that why someone living OUTSIDE of the US is required to maintain Obamacare mandadted insurance when they are not in the US to use it? It could not be possibly tied to the potential tax/penanlty could it?[/quote]

Of course they had to involve the IRS in running (enforcing) Obamacare…. it’s the government agency that people fear most and has the ability to make you penniless! They can take money right from your bank account if they choose to.

They’re already using the “tax” code as a backdoor welfare program for a good precentage of Obama supporters (ie The “earned” income credit)…. so why not!

[Imxploring]

[quote=”davidd”][quote=”VictoriaLST”]I used to work with teens who were drug dealers. Talk about money laundering….. When a 13 year old walks into a Nike store in NYC and buys $5,000 worth of clothing with cash, nobody questions it. Money laundering. Its everywhere.[/quote]

yep

now if your accused of whatever.. meaning if the gov wants you they will extradite you.

whether or not the charges are actually true or false is moot.

scary

http://insidecostarica.com/2013/05/30/after-liberty-reserve-costa-rica-considers-reforms-to-allow-extradition-of-citizens/

[/quote]

Yeah…. from a country that has openly thumbed it’s nose at several high profile child abduction / Hague Convention cases in the last decade!

Nice to be able to pick which laws and rules apply to you at will!

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[quote=”costaricabill”][quote=”imxploring”]
Right now I’m working on location. Next will be the specific complex.
Any advice would be welcome![/quote]

Did you review this?

https://www.welovecostarica.com/public/Costa-Rica-Condo-Comparison-Report-2013-Northwest-Guanacaste.cfm%5B/quote%5D

Reviewed that as well as some detailed complex and rental income reports provided by the agents I toured with. Great Info. Getting your feet on the ground is the final step! Thanks for the info!

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