Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”pixframe”]I do acknowledge the plight of this group where you don’t even comprehend it.[/quote]
And your response to them is “You made your choices, now live with their consequence and don’t expect any help from me”.
[/quote]Let me say it again. Regardless of how high a CAJA fee you’re willing to pay, this group of expats is still in a bind being FORCED to pay an increased rate (regardless of how small their increase).
Have a good Sunday, Sweik.
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”pixframe”]I’d expect you to be sympathetic to this group of expats instead of wearing a Scrooge-like blind eye to their predicament.[/quote]
On the contrary, I am very sympathetic to their plight – which is precisely why I have said on many occasions that I have no problem paying higher CAJA assessments if it means that those with less means pay less. It is also why I posted the report showing that the CR population over 65 is about to rise dramatically and that healthcare costs in CR (and therefore CAJA assessments) are certain to rise. Therefore anyone whose budget is already stretched thin better think long and hard before relocating to CR.You, on the other hand, have said repeatedly that you don’t think you should have to shoulder a higher burden because you have saved and invested wisely and that others who didn’t should be prepared to face the consequences of their lack of planning.[/quote]
This is not about YOU and the higher CAJA rate you’re prepared to pay! I’m speaking of a group that is being forced to pay a higher rate who can’t afford to pay a higher rate (regardless of how high a rate you pay) and also can’t afford to move.
Yes, it’s true I don’t believe I should shoulder the burden. And, yes, I do believe there are consequences of poor planning and/or lack of planning but I do acknowledge the plight of this group where you don’t even comprehend it.
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”pixframe”]There ARE people who HAVE pulled up their roots … HAVE relocated to Costa Rica … HAVE their residency … and having no other choice, ARE being forced to pay this new higher CAJA rate.[/quote]
“HAVE relocated to Costa Rica” – which they did for various reasons, no doubt, but one of them would probably be a cheaper cost of living. And if that cost differential is no longer to their advantage, they can relocate again. No one is forced to live in Costa Rica.You both seem to think that moving to Costa Rica is a voluntary thing but that continuing to live there isn’t. That’s just silly. Why do you keep insisting they have no other choice?
There have been many previous comments posted here about the percentage of expats who move back to their previous country of origin. I guess they didn’t get the memo that they were forced to remain there. LOL
Now it is certainly true that anyone who does contemplate moving there should be prepared to pay higher CAJA costs in coming years – as I am certainly planning for. But I strongly doubt that anyone who moved to Costa Rica was naive enough to believe that whatever their cost of living was on moving there was somehow guaranteed never to rise.[/quote]
I can speak only for myself (and not for anyone else on this board). My post was in regards to a specific group of people who can’t afford to uproot themselves again due to their limited finances (which brought them to Costa Rica in the first place).
You surprise me, Sweik! Being such a defender of the “less fortunate” in the USA, I’d expect you to be sympathetic to this group of expats instead of wearing a Scrooge-like blind eye to their predicament.
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”Imxploring”]CR is forcing folks..[/quote]
Nonsense, CR isn’t forcing anyone to do anything. You don’t HAVE to apply for residency, as your own future plans prove.
[quote=”Imxploring”]Fortunately I don’t have to do so.[/quote]
…And neither does anyone else.[/quote]There ARE people who HAVE pulled up their roots … HAVE relocated to Costa Rica … HAVE their residency … and having no other choice, ARE being forced to pay this new higher CAJA rate.
Has anyone in our group had any experience with the Instituto Nacional de Seguros’ (INS) regional medical plan? I’ve read that its premiums are reasonable but haven’t seen any actual premium quotes.
http://portal.ins-cr.com/NR/rdonlyres/AAFBB22F-5F00-4CDD-9DE9-A0C99F7FC34B/2245/ReferenciaCondicionesGeneralesINSMedicalRegional.pdf[quote=”Imxploring”][quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”Imxploring”]And the band plays on…. as the water rises. LOL[/quote]
How ever do you manage to get through a day with the hammer of doom just about to come down on so many fronts? LOL[/quote]Easy Steve…. I wear a life vest 24/7 and have lifeboats waiting for in a few different locations on the globe!
People don’t plan to fail… they fail to plan! Or in the case of most people these days, “reality” television has replaced REALITY and reading is something only old people do!!!! LOL
As we both know… all the information is out for folks to find, absorb, and plan life accordingly! History is not to be ignore as it repeats itself over and over. The laws of nature can’t be messed with or ignored either, yet folks seem to think that in today’s world ignorance is bliss and somehow it will all just work itself out![/quote]
So true!
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”pixframe”]Apparently you have a higher threshold for pain.[/quote][/quote]
Seems my little joke went flat since you omitted my “lol” at the end of that sentence.[quote=”sweikert925″] Well, I suppose that’s one way to look at it but I prefer looking at is as having a more generous nature. [/quote]
As I mentioned before, you don’t know the back story of any of us and most definitely you don’t know mine. Generous? I doubt you even come close to the spending I’ve done and still do to help others. I do it voluntarily (and to no benefit to myself … not even taking tax deductions)… all my decison to do so … and not the decision of any individual, group of individuals or governments dictating I do so and by how much!
[quote=”sweikert925″]Your bottom line is that everyone should pay an equal amount because that would be much better for you, and to hell with anyone else for whom paying that same amount would be a burden. [/quote]
No, I believe everyone paying the same for the same product, CAJA, is what is FAIR!. Why do you have difficulty understanding that? I take back the question, since I’m finished with discussing this matter there’s no need for you to reply to it.
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”pixframe”]while it’s become intolerable for others now it’s perfectly OK because it hasn’t yet affected you personally[/quote]
[quote=”sweikert925″] If the assessment reaches my previously stated pain point of $500 (about 45% of my initial fixed retirement income) it would affect a lot more people than just me. Your pain point, or the level at which you find the CAJA assessment intolerable is, apparently, $0.004 (4 tenths of a cent, or 2 colones) as long as someone, somewhere was paying 1 colon.
[quote=”pixframe”]Same product should have the same cost for ALL.[/quote] Buying an airline ticket must just about make your head explode. LOL[/quote]
If and when I require medical services in Costa Rica I will pay for them. I have no intention of putting my hand into anyone’s pocket but mine. And I would appreciate it Costa Rica and/or any other government not dig so deeply into mine.As I said earlier … I’m finished with this topic. Nothing more to be said by me on it.
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”pixframe”]And, as time passes and the Costa Rican government’s need for more and more money to fund itself grows and they expand their definition of rich to include you … let’s see what you’ll be saying then.[/quote]
[quote=”sweikert925″] Their definition of rich undoubtedly already includes me since the median income in Costa Rica is something like $6000/year and per capita GDP is about $13,000/year. My retirement income will be many times either of those figures.[/quote]Wishful thinking, Steve … lol. Based on your guesstimate of what you’ll be paying in to CAJA, the rate you’ve applied is not the top rate on the scale. So, NO, you’re still not there.
[quote=”sweikert925″]Now if you’re saying that there may come a point where they jack up the assessments to an intolerable level then I agree, that is certainly possible.[/quote]
BINGO! Apparently you have a higher threshold for pain … lol. So, you’re saying when the level becomes intolerable for you (when it puts a squeeze on your lifestyle) you agree … but until then … while it’s become intolerable for others now it’s perfectly OK because it hasn’t yet effected you personally.
[quote=”sweikert925″]But they are selling a product – residency in Costa Rica – and they have to price it based on what the market will bear. They are most probably aware that if they increase the CAJA assessments too much the expatriates will stop coming, and it obviously in their interest to prevent that situation.
Incidentally, are you aware that Costa Ricans currently contribute to CAJA at higher percentages than do expatriates that apply for residency there? For a Costa Rican the contribution rate is about 23%, with employers responsible for about 15% and the worker responsible for about 8%. (For the self-employed the CAJA assessment is between 10.5% and 13.5%). And bear in mind they have been paying that for their entire working lives, while US citizens landing in Costa Rica can, the day after their residency has been approved, start making use of CAJA services even though their contribution is at that point nearly nothing.[/quote]
Percentages? Let’s talk dollars … colones! Same product should have the same cost for ALL. And, as for paying in all their working lives … it’s a universal medical system. It’s not Medicare which one pays into all their working lives and only reap its benefits when they reach 65. They’ve been paying in all their working lives and have been utilizing it’s services all their working lives too.
I’ve discussed this subject long enough. Time for me to move on …
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”pixframe”]The reason many of us have our “bundle” is because we did without, made sacrifices, and saved in order to produce an income for ourselves in retirement[/quote]
Very commendable – and that pretty much sums up my situation too (though I wished I started saving 10 years earlier than I did).
But what you imply is that everyone who winds up with “a bundle” got there as a result of hard work and frugality and those who wound up poor didn’t work hard or save.[/quote]
No, Steve, there was no such implication.
[quote=”sweikert925″]That hasn’t been my experience of life. If being wealthy was purely a result of hard work then hotel chambermaids would wind up wealthier than bank vice-president, and, of course, they don’t. In my experience luck (and, sometimes, a willingness to cheat and steal) have more to do with how rich you wind up being than playing by the rules. Not that I am accusing you of the latter, but you can’t deny that some do get rich that way. [/quote]
Rich is a very subjective term. And, sometimes, a willingness to cheat and steal, is why some people are poor
too. Regardless of how folks managed to put together their bundle (work, smart investment decisions, inheritance, hit the lottery … whatever) … having it doesn’t mean they should be charged more for CAJA than folks who have less.[quote=”sweikert925″] At the end of the day though, the way taxes are imposed is merely a matter of practicality. If everyone paid the same then the rich would have a much easier load to bear – and the poor would have a much harder one. Seeing as they are already poor, why make them even poorer? Is that REALLY fair? [/quote]
Honestly … YES! It’s unfair for a government to impose their definition of rich upon us and decide how much those they define as rich … how much they need and how much they can do without in order to pass their wealth on to others of lesser means. That is very unfair!
[quote=”sweikert925″] It is easier to collect taxes from people who have means than those who don’t. Of course in your case the amount you wlll be paying for CAJA will be exactly $0.00 since you’ve already said you are going to forego residency and take the perpetual tourist route. [That’s something imexploring might call cheating or “gaming the system”, so be prepared to hear from him about that].[/quote]
First, please don’t speak for others or hint at what others may or may not be thinking. Let imxploring speak for himself. Yes, the perpetual tourist route is the route I’ll take. As I said before, the money I would have paid in to CAJA I’ll use to self insure … and in the event I require medical services while in Costa Rica I’ll pay for them.
I tend to believe you’re not seeing the big picture, Steve. What we’re discussing is the new CAJA policy. But, the big picture says this is the beginning … the tip of the iceberg! And, as time passes and the Costa Rican government’s need for more and more money to fund itself grows and they expand their definition of rich to include you … let’s see what you’ll be saying then.
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”pixframe”]Save your claim of non-“me-ness” to when you actually make that subtraction.[/quote]
I have been making that subtraction all of my adult life.Things I support as matters of public policy have affected me in the form of higher taxes and I won’t be changing that attitude when I arrive in CR. Imxploring’s income level may mean a higher CAJA assessment than mine, but mine will undoubtedly be higher than others’. I am not complaining about that, imxploring is. You righties are the one who insist on paying less in taxes – which directly benefits you. I am in favor of programs which result in my paying more. The equation is pretty simple.[/quote]
Another adage of my mother’s was “when you’re young you can do without but when you’re old you shouldn’t have to”. You don’t know the “back story” of any of us here. The reason many of us have our “bundle” is because we did without, made sacrifices, and saved in order to produce an income for ourselves in retirement. (I for one have no pension. I receive social security and the interest on my savings. My 401k, had no employer contributions, and IRA … I don’t consider them “pensions”. They were just different forms of savings to produce an income for me).
Of course you don’t mind paying more than others for CAJA. You estimate, at the most, you’ll be paying $130/month, the lower end of the fee scale … and for comparative purposes about $25 more than what the purchase of an all inclusive Medicare part B Advantage (HMO) plan would be. For $25 a month it’s easy being “the sport” saying you don’t mind paying more than others.
This is not a “rightie” or “leftie” issue. It’s a matter of fairness and there’s no fairness in some people being charged two, three, four or even more times more than what others are being charged for the same product. Why should those paying less for CAJA be the beneficiary of the years of sacrifices made by others instead of the children and grand children of those who made the sacrifices being the beneficiaries of those sacrifices?
The fairness of the new CAJA rates policy is the issue of this thread and I still maintain it’s an unfair policy.
[quote=”sweikert925″]Thanks for the definition of cheating but I was in no way confused about the meaning of that word, as opposed to your understanding of the word “socialist”. And I am still resentful of your accusation against me but looks like no apology is going to be forthcoming. C’est la vie.
You can question all you want the way any system is set up. But the fairness of such a system is not up to you to decide all by yourself. You are not the sole arbiter of what is fair.
Your particular situation in no way benefits me. [/quote]
Au contraire, Steve. It will benefit you. Folks paying more for CAJA (for the same product) are subsidizing those paying less.
[quote=”sweikert925″]Funny you should bring up the ME generation because the one who seems to be concerned more with “me-ness” here is you. It’s hard not to notice that all the policy positions you push here tend to – by the merest coincidence – benefit your bottom line while most of the ones I advocate tend to subtract from mine.[/quote]
Steve, what you’ve been doing is “predicting” how you’ll respond to some future situation. Only time will tell how you will actually respond. Save your claim of non-“me-ness” to when you actually make that subtraction.
As for fairness, my mother always told me “life isn’t fair” but we each can determine what we consider to be fair and live our lives accordingly. It’s my opinion the current method of calculating CAJA resulting in such extreme cost differences for the purchase of the same product … it’s my opinion it’s an unfair policy. As a result I won’t apply for residency and with the money I would have paid CAJA I’ll use it for 72 hours trips every 90 days and to self insure … and I’ll still have more than enough unspent to pay for a flight to a US hospital in the event I’ll need one.
[quote=”sweikert925″]I won’t have to declare my Social Security when I arrive in CR because my current plan is to delay filing for SS as long as possible. Between my pensions and my savings I will have more than enough to live on and only my pensions are used for calculating the CAJA assessment. The amount of my pensions alone are enough to satisfy the pensionista requirement.
For every year I delay filing for SS benefits, I would get an extra $170 per month – forever (plus whatever annual inflation adjustment is awarded). Why would I file for Social Security before arriving in CR if I didn’t need to?[/quote]
Sorry. I tend to forget not everyone made the same choices as I did (I stopped working at 57 and took early Social Security at 62. BTW,. delaying social security until 70 is a very BAD decision .. but not a conversation to be had here).
Amending my question, when your social security kicked in at 70 would you declare it and pay that 10-17% (probably higher by then) of it to CAJA …?
So, you won’t declare any of the income on your savings? Being as socially conscious as you lead me to believe you are, I’d think you’d also declare the income from your savings so that the 10-17% bite out of it could help those in circumstances less fortunate than yours.
[quote=”sweikert925″][quote=”pixframe”]I would appreciate some clarification regarding your statement “I will declare the full amount of the fixed income that I am then receiving when I make my application – whatever is required by the applicable law” with the key phrase being “whatever is required by the applicable law”. [/quote]
What part of “comply fully with the applicable law” didn’t you understand? If the law requires me to provide proof of all fixed income sources then that is what I will do.[/quote]It not what we say. It’s how we say it. If the applicable law stated “proof of income” (notice the absence of the word TOTAL) and “the required minimum of $1,000/month for residence” (again … where “total” was implied but not stated) would you declare just the social security or your social security and other income (of which CAJA would take a 10-17% bite out of)?
